[lit-ideas] A True Derbicism (Was: False Cockneysms and Trudgill's "N. O. R. M."
- From: Jlsperanza@xxxxxxx
- To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 22:04:44 EDT
ENGLAND, THEIR ENGLAND
Re: Saml. Pegge, Esq. FSA
"The Penny Magazine" of 1835. On January 17 that magazine published a
summary of a work by Dr. Samuel Pegge, under the headline, "Anecdotes of the
English Language." The argument was that, "the great majority of what are
called
'cockneyisms' are not, as is commonly supposed, corruptions of the language,
but were formerly in use among good writers, and have been retained by the
Londoners after the literary and the refined have given them up."
I was reminded of the book originally recommended to me by Janet Poulton,
"The Madman and the Lexicographer", about mainly James Murray.
I'm surprised the Pegge was interested in the urban dialect of London
(Cockney). At that time, it was considered that only N.O.R.M. al people counted
(what Trudgill calls "nonmobile, older, rural, men". Whereas Londoners were
thought to be mainly immigrants.
Indeed the Cockney-Continental Europe connection is the root of many
music-hall jokes, like Flanagan's "Oy" (Bud Flanagan was born Israel Weinthrop,
within the Sound of Bow Bells).
Note that one of the references by Pegge is on "Derbicisms". I loved that
phrase. His father was indeed of Derbyshire stock, and I guess his surname
means "Pig" -- which, while not Anglo-Saxon "swine" is not Norman "pork" either
(see Scott, Ivanhoe).
I forget the birthplace of James Murray -- but wasn't he a genial man!
Someone should film that book that narrates his interactions with the
(American)
Civil War Veteran. I suggest Daniel Day Lewis plays James Murray (Lewis is out
in a recent film whose trailer I've just seen). Less sure who could play
Minor -- I'd recomment Heath Ledger.
What I don't like about the Murray history, but see the point of it, is that
he dismissed Middle English and Dialect English. Not to mention Anglo-Saxon.
Thus, Murray was (why?) into "New English" (NED being the old name for the
OED). Joseph Wright had to take care of the English Dialect Dictionary (never
updated), and while Skeat has his own Etym. Dictionary, it's Bosworth/Toller
that considered the standard (never updated).
Meanwhile, we have day-by-day horrendous updates to the OED3, with things
like "training bra" and other stupidities.
Fascinating note, thanks Ritchie. More on Pegge Jr. below.
Cheers,
JL
_http://www.kcl.ac.uk/depsta/iss/library/speccoll/bomarch/bomjune06.html_
(http://www.kcl.ac.uk/depsta/iss/library/speccoll/bomarch/bomjune06.html)
"In 1832 Samuel Pegge's manuscripts were acquired by F. Madden, the eminent
palaeographer. When they came into his possession Madden was Keeper of
Manuscripts at the British Museum. Madden recorded his acquisition of the
manuscripts on their opening leaves. In Collectanea glossographica he has
written:
This volume is in the handwriting of Samuel Pegge, Esq. F.S.A. son of the
Revd. Samuel Pegge LLD. He died in 1800. F.M. Bound up withPegge's Provincial
Glossary and Dr Pegge's Remarks on the Source of the English Language.Saml.
Pegge, F.S.A. He goes on to say:
When I purchased this book of J.B. Nichols in June 1832 it was bound up with
Mr Samuel Pegge's Collection of Old Words, and with Dr Pegge's
"Considerations on the English Language" - I have now rebound them in Three
Two volumes.
He clearly thought them valuable enough to spend ten guineas on their
purchase.
Upon Madden's death in 1873 the Pegge manuscripts were purchased by W. W.
Skeat (1835-1912), founder of the English Dialect Society Skeat recorded his
acquisition of the manuscripts "for the use of the English Dialect Society"
After Skeat's own death in 1913 his books and papers, including the Pegge
manuscripts, were given to King's (College), The Strand.
In October 1887, as a pencil note in Skeat's hand explains, the MSS were
formally lent by Skeat to his friend and fellow-philologist, Scot-born Dr
James
Murray (1837-1915), indefatigable editor of the Oxford English Dictionary.
"I intend shortly to pack up and send you Pegge's MSS. I have used them as
far [as] I want. They are poor but there are numerous references in them."
IMurray found the manuscripts of more use than Skeat had apparently done
(although Skeat's assurance that he had no further use for them is perhaps
somewhat undermined by a pencil note in his hand on the fly-leaf of the same
volume stating that they should be "returned, when required" ). In 1887, the
date
of the loan, only one letter (A) of the proposed Oxford English Dictionary
had been completed.
Skeat may have found the Pegge manuscripts "poor" and there is no doubt that
many of the entries are merely preliminary jottings or brief references that
Pegge failed to follow up in their later researches:
Higgledy-Piggledy. I wou'd suppose it to have been originally
Hoggledy-Piggledy, from Hogs and Pigs lying promiscuously together.
Ramage's Half Crown. A Commonwealth piece so call'd from one Ramage who sunk
the die … One at Mr Bartlett's Sale fetch'd £30.
Sheep-Reeve. The monastick term for a Shepherd among Abbots.
Sops & Ale. A festive custom formerly in use at East-Bourne in Sussex. See
E. Bourne Guide. 123. The time of year is not mentioned.
Names of old dances include "Shaking of the Sheets", "Barley-Break - a
rustick Dance with Hands taken all round", "Canary - a brisk light dance" and
"Dump - an Italian dance of the lively kind"; and among the names of old card
games are "Prima Vista", "Saint-Maw", "Mum-Chance", "Noddy" and "Knave out of
Doors".
Further reading
Thompson Cooper, "Pegge, Samuel, rev. K. D. Reynolds, Oxford Dictionary of
National Biography, Oxford University Press, 2004 John H. Farrant, "Grose,
Francis (bap. 1731, d. 1791)", Oxford Dictionary of National Biography, Oxford
University Press, 2004; online edn, May 2005
Johnathon Green. Chasing the sun: lexicographers and the dictionaries they
made. London: Jonathan Cape, 1996
Linda Mugglestone [editor]. Lexicographers and the OED: pioneers in the
untrodden forest. Oxford: OUP, 1999
K.M. Elisabeth Murray. Caught in the web of words: James A.H. Murray and the
Oxford English dictionary. New Haven, Conn.: Yale University Press, 1977
Margaret O'Sullivan, "Pegge, Samuel. Oxford Dictionary of National
Biography, Oxford University Press, 2004
Rosemary Sweet. Antiquaries: the discovery of the past in eighteenth century
Britain. London: Hambledon, 2004
Archaeologia, or, Miscellaneous tracts relating to antiquity. London:
Society of Antiquaries, 1770-1849 [Rare Journals Collection]
The gentleman's magazine, or, Monthly intelligencer. London: for R. Newton,
1731-1833 [Rare Journals Collection] Also available online (1731-1750) via:
William Bray. Sketch of a tour into Derbyshire and Yorkshire. Second
edition. London: printed for B. White, 1783 [Marsden Collection Add.O2]
Francis Grose. A classical dictionary of the vulgar tongue. The third
edition, corrected and enlarged. London: printed for Hooper and Co., 1796 [
Francis Grose. A glossary of provincial and local words used in England … To
which is now first incorporated the supplement by Samuel Pegge. London: John
Russell Smith, 1839 [Miscellaneous PE1667.G91]
Francis Grose. A provincial glossary: with a collection of local proverbs,
and popular superstitions. London: printed for S. Hooper, 1790 [Rare Books
Collection PE1766.G9]
John Kersey. Dictionarium Anglo-Britannicum, or, A general English
dictionary. The third edition, corrected and enlarged. London: printed for J.
Phillips, 1721 [Rare Books Collection PE1620.K41]
Edward Moor. Suffolk localisms, or, An attempt to collect the lingual
localisms of that county. Woodbridge: printed for J. Loder, 1823
Samuel Pegge. Two collections of Derbicisms containing words and phrases in
a great measure peculiar to the natives and inhabitants of the county of
Derby. Edited, with two introductions, by the Rev. Professor Skeat and Thomas
Hallam. London: for the English Dialect Society, 1896
John Ray. A glossary of English words not generally used. London: printed
for Christopher Wilkinson, 1691 [Marsden Collection O7/25]
Roger Wilbraham. An attempt at a glossary of some words used in Cheshire.
London: printed by W. Bulmer and W. Nicol, 1820 [Marsden Collection O7/6]
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