[lit-ideas] Re: A Movie [longish]
- From: "Lawrence Helm" <lawrencehelm@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2006 17:42:31 -0700
Omar, I don't feel a particular urge to discuss this with you, and since you
didn't read all of my note your claim to want to discuss something is not to
be credited.:
1) I discussed this in the note you are responding to; so you shouldn't be
asking this question. However I'll elaborate a bit just to be sociable:
Militant Islam has two main parts to it. The first, Islamism, is an
ideology that has grown up around the teachings of Wahhabism, Salafism,
Maududi, Al Banna, Sayyid Qutb and Khomeini. It advocates a Fundamentalist
adherence to the Sharia, but most important for us and important in their
thinking is the advocacy of the Jihad for the furtherance of their doctrine.
They advocate violence against the governments of the nations they find
themselves in for after all these are but remnants of Colonialism and the
new leaders are worse than the old Colonialists. They advocate violence
against those who do not adhere to the Sharia because such people are the
same as infidels. They advocate violence against infidels. Killing
Civilians is okay because all infidels deserve death. Killing infidels
while blowing yourself up is a noble thing and individuals who do that are
to be praised as martyrs. Within Islamism are activist organization like Al
Quaeda, Hamas and Hezbollah, but anyone is entitled to strap bombs to
himself and blow up infidels. It is all good. The near-term goal is to
reclaim all the land previously held by Islam including Andalusia. The
ultimate goal is to claim the entire world for Islamism.
The second part is Pan-Arabism. This ideology advocates the return of the
Caliphate and an elimination of borders created by Europeans after WWI.
There is but one ummah and there should be but one leader over the ummah.
Nassar was the first modern Pan-Arabist who wanted to lead the Arabian Umma.
Later Saddam Hussein sought to be that leader. With the elimination of
Saddam Hussein, the Pan-Arabist aspect of Militant Islam has been largely
neutralized. The weakest link, Syria, still exist as ostensibly advocating
this view.
2) I discussed this in the note you are responding to so you shouldn't be
asking this question, but I'll elaborate further just to be sociable: The
numbers of militant Islam were discussed in the note you are responding to.
I don't understand what more you want. We are here dealing with a very
backward people not much given to free speech, opinion polls, etc., so
"experts" can but guess. You and I debated this matter in the past. You
felt the Moderates were more numerous than the Militants. I found no
evidence from this. I only heard the Militants speaking out. There were no
Moderates speaking out in the Middle East. So they are either numerous but
silent or not numerous. The one estimate I saw is that 30% of the
300,000,000 Arabs were Militants, but I suspect the number is much larger.
If the Majority were Moderates surely they would find some means of speaking
their moderation and this hasn't occurred to my knowledge. Some
post-colonial governments oppose Islamism but we hear the Islamists are
barely kept in check in those nations. Moderates don't even dare to speak
out there -- in Egypt for example.
3) You didn't read the rest of my note, did you?
4) What do I expect the rest of the world to do when? You obviously didn't
read my note. You and Irene both have a very bad habit of just reading a
line or two and making an assumption about the rest of the note. That might
be okay if you weren't all so inclined to dash off a note asking for a
response that is contained in the note you obviously didn't read. This is
always irritating and the older I get the more I am inclined to say so.
Lawrence
-----Original Message-----
From: lit-ideas-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:lit-ideas-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
On Behalf Of Omar Kusturica
Sent: Thursday, August 10, 2006 4:58 PM
To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: A Movie [longish]
--- Lawrence Helm <lawrencehelm@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> Paul,
>
>
>
> I just turned on my computer and was surprised to
> find 36 notes in my
> Lit-Ideas inbox, this note (your initial note) and
> 35 following. I
> appreciated your note and read it twice. I didn't
> appreciate the notes
> following that attempted to take things off on a
> tangent or quibble about
> how many people you want to destroy.
*Well, Lawrence, I am sorry to interfere in your
exchange of ideological pronouncements with a new
comrade, but there is a couple of quibbles here. If
you are seriosuly proposing to 'eliminate militant
Islam,' you should be able to explain at least:
1. What is 'militant Islam' ?
2. How many proponents does it have, and how can they
be identified ?
3. How is 'eliminating' to be done, and by whom ?
4. What do you expect the rest of the world is going
to do ?
When that is clarified, we could perhaps discuss your
proposal seriously.
O.K.
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