Phil Thanks for the advice. I tried that but it does not wind on even with manual winder in the "rest" position. I have just spoken to Leica UK and they think there is a problem. It is a second hand drive and the supplier has agreed to my returning it. Chris Phil writes: DK about the R8 - haven't got a drive or winder on it - but with the R3 W = and R4 MD it also depends on the position of the manual winding lever - yo= u might give it a try. Just a guess then. Phil...x ------ Unsubscribe or change to/from Digest Mode at: http://www3.telus.net/~telyt/lrflex.htm Archives are at: //www.freelists.org/archives/leicareflex/