[LRflex] Re: The DMR as a Collectible.
- From: Colin Howarth <colin@xxxxxxxxxx>
- To: leicareflex@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2007 23:17:31 +0100
This whole thing is confoundedly complicated.
Normally, I would say "it's the sensor which is critical", to which
my brother would reply "no, it's the user interface that is most
important".
The iPod is successful because it's UI is simple and elegant. Not
because it can take photos, tell you your GPS location or make a cup
of tea. It can't do any of those - but it can play music - very well.
On the other hand, it was my impression that Nikon makes cameras
which are better in every single way than those of Canon. Except in
image quality. :-(
Many people moan about full-frame sensors - and get ridiculed by
others who say there's nothing magical about 24x36 mm. That it's old-
fashioned, whatever.
Well, lets take a look at the prices for the Canon 30D, 5D and 1Ds Mk
II.
EUR 1150 8.2 Mpix
EUR 2450 12.8 Mpix
EUR 6990 16.7 Mpix
The 5D costs more than *twice* as much as the 30D. It has fewer
frames per second and no built-in flash. All it has is a full-frame
sensor instead of a 1.6 x one (and a couple more pixels).
The 5D is very popular since it has a FF sensor and is *only* twice
as expensive (instead of six times as expensive !!!)
Do people want FF? Yes. And it's not just because they want to use
their wides. The depth-of-field of a 50 mm on the 30D is not the same
as that of an 80 mm on the 5D.
If Leica could get a 18-24 Mpix FF sensor with excellent low-noise
capability at high ISOs I actually believe they would be quite good
at specifying an excellent UI. It would be rugged, intuitive and
beautiful. A pleasure to use.
Of course, I haven't checked, but Canon and Nikon et. al. probably
have a couple of patents on dSLR cameras - which could cause some wee
problems...
And if there aren't any auto-focus lenses you can forget most of the
pro market anyway.
I don't see how they can make a real pro dSLR.
But I wish they would :-)
colin
On 10.02.2007, at 22:35, William Abbott wrote:
> David wrote,
>
> "It's the engineering dept, I worry about!"
>
> I agree wholeheartedly, but it is particularly the systems
> engineering and program management functions that I worry about, not
> the excellent mechanical and electrical engineering and human
> interface design sections Leica undoubtedly has, because the digital-
> camera-in-the-user's-hand is now as much a creature of the sensor and
> the software as it is of the glass. That's what's new to Leica about
> this.
>
> This brings up three problems for Leica: choosing the optimum sensor
> technology, choosing an appropriate sensor source, and finding ways
> to successfully integrate that source into the development,
> production, and support phases. And doing the same for software.
>
> Working productively with critical sources is an area in which Leica
> has not lately demonstrated an overabundance of competence, IMHO, but
> it is the heart of the matter and the heart of my concern.
>
> Thinking about legacy Leica-R glass, modern "expected" functionality,
> and sensors, I am struck by the absence of comments or information or
> guesses here about sensors, because it well may be that the future of
> the beloved Leica-R system depends more on the capabilities and
> promises of Kodak (or others in its industry) than anything Leica can
> do in its own house, much as many aircraft designs were critically
> dependent on their engine manufacturers, who sometimes delivered and
> sometimes didn't. Perhaps this group's experience isn't heavily
> directed towards sensors; I know virtually nothing about them.
>
> I do recall that the DMR sensor "features" micro-lenses that redirect
> light rays from legacy glass to intersect the sensor perpendicularly
> but my guess is that that "feature" cannot be in the path to the
> future because of cost.
>
> Gary Todoroff's "Lympa," a marriage of Leica-R glass and an Olympus
> E-330 digital body, may presage our future because Leica, Olympus,
> and Kodak are members of the Four Thirds group, and Leica already has
> a Four Thirds product, the V-Lux 1. Based on the Lympa, I expect the
> R10 to preserve backward compatibility with legacy glass, but only in
> a limited sense, omitting many of the new features available with new
> glass. That is also what Nikon did.
>
> For more go to:
> http://www.four-thirds.org/en/about/group.html (very interesting in
> general)
> http://www.northcoastphotos.com/Lympa.htm (very interesting in
> particular)
>
> There is an old joke about a kid who wanted a pony for Christmas and
> someone left him a pile of horse manure under a his Christmas tree as
> a cruel prank. The kid, seeing the pile, starts pawing through it,
> and says, "I know there's a pony in there somewhere!"
>
> I sure hope so.
>
> As ever,
>
> Bill
>
> On Feb 10, 2007, at 11:28 AM, David Young wrote:
>
> At 10/02/2007, you wrote:
>> David,
>> I agree with all of your points, BUT, unless Leica can somehow slip
>> their R&D
>> budget into the U.S. Defense Department budget ( or somehow get VP
>> Dick
>> Cheney & his "Buddies" at Halliburton to buy into Leica), they'll be
>> a few Euros
>> short of what's needed.
>>
>> Art
>
>
> I don't think so. ACM, the new owners, have VERY deep pockets, and
> are committed to making Leica a viable, commercial success.
>
> It's the engineering dept, I worry about!
>
> ---
>
> David Young,
> Logan Lake, CANADA
>
> Wildlife Photographs: http://www.telyt.com/
> Personal Web-pages: http://www3.telus.net/~telyt
>
>
>
>
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