Hi Walter, I saw your post about shooting in low-light conditions. If you want to stop motion, fast shutter speeds are the only way to go, which means large apertures, high ISO, and preferably a larger-than APS-C sensor i.e. "full frame" or 135-size. As others have pointed out, the problem with ultra-fast apertures is the depth-of-field gets (possibly) unusably small, perhaps defeating the original intent of you want detail in more than one location. On the other hand, if your subject/s are relatively stationary, there is another (much less expensive) way: a good, recent APS-C camera and a lens with VR/IS. This sort of setup has several advantages (besides cost) over the full-frame/super-fast lens alternative: a stopped-down lens (with VR/IS) will have a much greater depth-of-field for any given field of view because a) it's stopped down, and b) the focal length will be shorter, by 1.5-1.6x. You can hand-hold at *far* lower shutter speeds with VR/IS, and the longer exposures mean you can keep the ISO under control. Here are some examples I shot in a cave at ISO800 with shutter speeds of 1/8 to 1/3s, handheld: http://www.pbase.com/smcleod965/wombeyan_caves&page=all The 16-85VR is an excellent lens, and a camera such as the D90 would provide even cleaner results in terms of noise. To get the same results in terms of depth-of-field with a full-frame camera and no VR, using DSC_1131 as an example: DSC_1131 1/3s f/5.6 72mm ISO800 "Full-frame": first the focal length would need to be at least 105mm (actually 109mm). Luckily Nikon have fast 105mm lens, the 105/2DC. So far so good. Then we look at depth-of-field - to get into the same range you'd need to be stopped down to f/8. Now you have 2 choices: drop the shutter speed to 2/3s (no chance of hand-holding a 105mm lens there) or crank up the ISO. Even at ISO6400 the shutter speed will still be an unusably low 1/12s. To get to (say) 1/50s would need ISO25,600. I know that full-frame cameras are good at high-ISOs but they are not *that* good (i.e. not 5 stops better). Opening the lens up all the way to f/2 gets you 4 more stops of light, so if you stick to a reasonable (for FF) ISO of, say, 3200, you can be 1 full stop ahead of the APS-C setup, and have a choice of 1/200s, *or* stopping down to f/2.8, *or* dropping the ISO to 1600 (which will probably look cleaner than ISO800 on APS-C). Unfortunately you now only have 1/4 to 1/3 of the DOF, which may not be enough (and will certainly be noticeable in a side-by-side comparison). In this particular case, Nikon also make a stabilized 105mm lens, in which case you are in the clear. But that is not true for all focal lengths... In summary, for things that move, get a full-frame camera (even a good, used Canon 5D) and the fastest lens you can afford. For things that don't move (or move very slowly or intermittently) a good APS-C camera with a stabilized lens is a better bet (IMO) Hope this helps, Scott McLeod ------ Unsubscribe or change to/from Digest Mode at: http://www.lrflex.furnfeather.net/ Archives are at: //www.freelists.org/archives/leicareflex/