[LRflex] Re: Future R system
- From: David Simms <simmszee@xxxxxxxx>
- To: leicareflex@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2010 18:12:02 -0700 (PDT)
I wouldn't want to appear like a Luddite but, I think that Big Business is
really putting the hard sell on digital. On the other hand, smaller, more
marginal companies like Adox etc, are buying up the old technology; the film
and
paper fabricating machines and techniques from the big operators like Kodak, to
fill the void. In a way, wouldn't you agree with the theory that if enough
people give up on film and accept its inevitable demise, then that's what will
happen?
The nice thing is that film is a pretty basic technology. Remember that, at the
inception of photography, photographers would coat the glass plates themselves.
So, film photography will survive, if not in the precise format that you or I
are used to, then in some guise.
Consider, too, that as various film and paper technologies become rare, the
fine
art community, and the elites of society, will become more and more intrigued
with it..."Oh, this is a silver print....how absolutely rare and beautiful...
and the cognoscenti will also want to exhibit and collect such work. This, I
think, will keep film alive.
What's that saying..."rumours of my death are greatly exaggerated" ? I'm much
more optimistic than I was three or four years ago.
Dave, Clearwater, BC
________________________________
From: Andy Wagner <yxandy2001@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: leicareflex@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Fri, August 6, 2010 4:00:27 PM
Subject: [LRflex] Re: Future R system
There is a valid point to the profit and "planned obsolesence"arguments but I
think the biggest part of "that old stuff" is the fact that film and processing
are disappearing at a very fast rate(much faster than I thought it would) and
in
the not to distant future there will only be a couple of choices left for us
diehards. Face it the world is moving forward and we have a choice move with it
or lament what once was. What is sad is the fact that Leica made all these
promises for an R10 using the technology that they've gained in building the
M's
and S's and then abandoning us R users. My feeling is that the promises
were given just so that they could move the last of the R lenses that they had
in stock with no intent of producing a body to mount them on. I really don't
hold out much hope for an adaquate solution.
Face it they have all the tooling inplace for the R9, what would it take to rip
out the guts and replace it with electronics.
Ah but we are only very small voices :-(
------ >--
Regards
YXAndy
________________________________
From: David Simms <simmszee@xxxxxxxx>
To: leicareflex@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Fri, August 6, 2010 4:27:24 PM
Subject: [LRflex] Re: Future R system
Excuse me, i realize that this was addressed to Ted. But, here's my take...
They probably have a bigger profit margin with digital. Plus, there's the
built-in obsolescence factor. And, I'll bet that there are more people doing
photography now than there ever were. They probably order more prints than
ever.
Once a digital camera is done, it's done. Could you imagine a digital camera
lasting 50 years or more? Then, there are the accessories...
Dave, Clearwater, BC
________________________________
From: Robert Lilley <speyerdom@xxxxxxx>
To: leicareflex@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Fri, August 6, 2010 1:50:38 PM
Subject: [LRflex] Re: Future R system
Dr. Ted, I'm an amateur landscape kinda guy. I managed printing and graphics
most of my life and was of the generation that brought digital to graphics,
etc. I have stayed analog in photography perhaps because it wasn't like work -
sitting at a desk behind a computer and there is nothing like a real silver
print. Why is it that every camera shop I talk to tries to convert me over to
digital? Today I talked to a Leica dealer in New Jersey about R cameras and
lenses. Wanted to see if they had any lenses in stock, etc. I was asked why I
wanted to "mess with all that old stuff for". -=sigh=-
Rob
On Aug 6, 2010, at 12:33 PM, tedgrant@xxxxxxx wrote:
>
> Robert Lilley asked:
> Subject: [LRflex] Re: Future R system
>
>
>> Alex,
>> I have been caught up in the Medium Format/Large Format debate as well. I
>> own several MF and LF cameras. I have lugged all this equipment about in
>> the field. Its not only about cameras and lenses, its also about getting
>> a large camera and it's film to the scene and keeping it motionless when
>> you get there. I have invested quite a bit of money in tripods, heads,
>> backpacks and other ancillary equipment to do this. Every time I am in
>> the field I am reminded of this 1950's film about a bunch of peasants who
>> drag this huge canon over hill and dale to attack a fort. I have
>> invested in a large darkroom that can handle up to 5x7" without a problem.
>> But...
>>
>> I am starting to wonder if it is really worth it after seeing the pictures
>> taken with R cameras by this group. I have come to the conclusion that
>> its not about negative size. It is all about the quality of the lens and
>> tripping the shutter at the right place and time. I have only a R4 and a
>> Summicron 2.8 50mm at this point. This combination takes wonderful
>> pictures. I am seriously thinking about selling all my LF and MF kit and
>> buying a complete Leica R system.
>>
>> Question is, what do I buy? Hmmm...
>
> Hi Rob,
> Simple answer...with a question? "WHAT DO YOU SHOOT?"
>
> If it's sports it's long glass from 280mm and longer, a 15mm just in case,
> the 80-200 zoom, just in case, the Noctilux... just in case? And the list
> goes on.
>
> However it still comes down to one question......... "what do you shoot and
> what do you like to shoot?"
> Answer these, then we can go from there.
>
> I've been an R and M user since they came out, other than the first SLR I
> never bothered with... no loss! My usual body count was always 3 motor
> driven bodies always... Sl, SL2, R4, R7, R8 being the last. I've switched to
> CANON digi camera bodies and lens adapters. Those who complain about lack of
> auto-focus, read my lips.... "GET OVER IT!" If you are a LEICA user it's
> always been manual!
>
> And the stopped down metering, another no big deal, get over it and start
> shooting. In many cases I've nearly always shot with the widest possible
> aperture and fastest shutter speed. WHY? Well it helps clear the crap out of
> backgrounds and helps with the possibility of camera shake by using high
> shutter speeds.
>
> Yep I know others cringe at this description but, yes I do shoot stopped
> down when the photo situation calls for it. Other wise it's wide open or a
> stop or two down. Exposures were always just ducky! :-)
>
> As a photojournalist and a non-techie type I just bought Leica glass in
> relation to the type of photography I was shooting, documentary, magazines
> and commercial assignments. And because the LEICA GLASS is the best damn
> image cutting glass on the market. Oh I know I'll get arguments, not worth
> my time to listen to nor reading! Simply because my comments about LEICA
> stuff, good, bad or ugly. Are given after being a professional
> photojournalist with 60 years experience and still shooting! Not the
> manual reading opinions of techie types.
>
> My Canon digital camera with the 280mm 2.8 shooting baseball and other
> sports produces wonderful images that look smashing at print sizes usually
> made filling 13X19 size Epson paper.
>
> So mon mi, answer the question.... "what do you or are you shooting" then
> maybe an answer of glass can be offered.
>
> For all those hand wringing crying about not having a digital R body, "GET
> OVER IT AND MOVE ON!" Before most of us ever see one from Leica other than
> the $25,000 or whatever price the S line cost, we'll all be in camera
> heaven. :-)
>
> cheers,
> Dr. ted
>
> tedgrantphoto.com ............ have a look at some samples and all LEICA.
>
>
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