[jhb_airlines] Re: report 156

  • From: "tom smith" <ftd.smith@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • To: <jhb_airlines@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Tue, 19 Oct 2004 22:34:29 +0100

Kevin would you send me a copy please.
I can now take off and fly a flight plan
but a am finding the landings difficult some times cheating and landing 
manual
Tom
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Kevin Townsend" <kev@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <jhb_airlines@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Tuesday, October 19, 2004 10:15 PM
Subject: [jhb_airlines] Re: report 156


> Just to add a little I have gleaned from my hours in the PMDG 737, Bones'
> lesson appears, as usual, spot on.
>
> My checklist suggests V2 as the initial dial up speed for the 
> autothrottle,
> once airborne and at 1000ft (If everything happens to plan) you select 
> LNAV
> before AP. This automatically adds 20knots to the selected speed as you
> climb and reduce flaps on schedule. After the aircraft is clean, or as
> directed by ATC you increase speed to 250kts until above 10,000ft. The
> choice of "Speed" or "NI" within the speed setting determines the best 
> rate
> of climb, or angle of climb (I think).
> As you approach the operational ceiling, the FPD shows maximum speed as
> candy stripes on the speed tape section. This is determined by weight,
> speed maybe even meteorological conditions. I have achieved around 330kts
> so far in the cruise.
>
> Commencement of descent can, I understand, be a rule of thumb plan which
> suggests Altitude (drop a nought) x 3   ie  FL 330 = 99miles
> I agree however that this aircraft is like quicksilver, and if you are
> flying with the wind you will need some spoiler, sometimes even managing
> descent rate in fpm.
>
> I do however subscribe to the view of avoiding direct approaches when not
> under IFR and ATC control. The FMC in the 737 is highly sophisticated and
> confirmation of approaches, STAR's etc can be programmed at the point ATIS
> is received, I always therefore plan to overfly the airfield navaid at 
> say,
> 3000ft then fly outbound adjacent to the ILS path, at around 10 miles out 
> I
> fly a teardrop pattern to bring me into alignment with the approach path.
> This gives me sufficient time to aviate, navigate and communicate, it also
> allows plenty of time to establish on the localiser, and select Approach
> mode on the MCP. Landing configuration is also selected in the FMC (based
> on flap settings and headwind) which sets the autothrottle at the correct
> approach speed. This is often the real world approach scenario I believe.
>
> Great knowledge from Bones, as always! (I hope you are feeling better 
> John)
>
> Best Wishes
>
> Kevin
> Diamond 175
>
> p.s. I can let you have a copy of this checklist If you want!
>
> At 16:22 10/19/2004, you wrote:
>>Speed management is the real key to flying jets. For most of the flight 
>>you
>>can ease the workload by letting the autothrottle do all the work - a 
>>luxury
>>if you are moving up from turboprops or pistons.
>>
>>The only thing to remember is that the autothrottle no longer disconnects
>>automatically when you turn off the autopilot (it used to in FS98). You 
>>have
>>to manually disconnect it by using the mouse or by pressing CTRL + R (you
>>can also arm the autothrottle by pressing SHIFT + R).
>>
>>The speeds I am going to quote assume you have set the airspeed indicator 
>>to
>>operate in IAS mode rather than TAS
>>
>>Before take off dial up a speed of 250kts on the panel. After you get
>>airborne you can then engage the autothrottle and let it manage thespeed
>>for you. Once you get above FL100 increase the speed to 300kts - this is
>>good for a cruise climb but not all aircraft will manage this - some may
>>settle down around 280kts.
>>
>>Despite setting 300kts the aircraft will actually be flying faster and
>>faster as you go higher. As the air gets thinner the ASI will under read
>>more and more. To stop overspeeding the trick is to switch the speed 
>>setting
>>from kts to Mach No as you climb. As you climb above 31,000 ft (if you are
>>going that high) keep an eye on the ASI - especially the Mach No value. 
>>This
>>will steadily increase as you climb and when it reaches Mach 0.76 switch 
>>the
>>speed display over to Mach Number. The aircraft will now continue to climb
>>at Mach 0.76. Once you have reached your cruising level you can set the 
>>Mach
>>cruise speed for the aircraft (usually between Mach 0.82 and Mach 0.86). 
>>The
>>ASI will still be reading somewhere in the 250 - 300 kt region during this
>>time but you can ignore this.
>>
>>Descent is the tricky bit as you need to think ahead quite a bit. Plan 
>>well
>>ahead - if you are at FL300 you should be starting down at least 100nm 
>>from
>>your destination. The "proper" way to descend is the reverse of the climb
>>but in FS you could get away with switching direct to an IAS descent. Just
>>check your current indicated airspeed. If it is over 300kts then dial up
>>300kts for the descent but if it is less than 300kts then dial in 250kts.
>>You can now leave the speed alone for the whole of the descent down to
>>FL100. Ignore the fact that some aircraft are so clean that they won't
>>reduce to these speeds even with the throttles fully shut - this is why 
>>you
>>start your descent earlier rather than later. Getting too high and too 
>>fast
>>is something that happens in real life too.
>>
>>Once you are down to FL100 you should be planning your initial approach
>>procedures. Again it helps to get speeds back early to slow things down 
>>and
>>increase thinking time and here I can use a good real life example of the
>>Heathrow procedures. Inbound from the north you will be routed HON WCO BNN
>>and if you are lucky you will be cleared to BNN at FL70 (bottom of the 
>>stack
>>so no holding..).
>>
>>At WCO you should reduce speed to 210kts. BNN is the holding stack for
>>Heathrow and it is important to get the speed back to 210kts BEFORE you
>>reach this point. This is the maximum allowed speed for any holding 
>>pattern.
>>Once you are cleared from BNN towards the ILS (and usually cleared down 
>>from
>>FL70 to 3000ft) reduce speed to 180kts. You will probably need to lower
>>flaps for this so check the flap schedule for your aircraft - on some it 
>>may
>>be Flap 10 but some will be Flap 15. You can stay at 180kts until you 
>>start
>>to intercept the ILS.
>>
>>Once the ILS is active you reduce speed to your approach speed. Again 
>>check
>>the aircraft you are flying but with flaps at 20 or 25 you should be 
>>around
>>150kts for the early 737's, 160kts for the later 737's and about 170kts 
>>for
>>a 747. This is off the top of my head so don't quote me on these figures -
>>they may be slightly less.  In real life we would work out the exact
>>approach speed depending on the weight of the aircraft and you can do this
>>in FS too - but you should work this out during your pre flight planning 
>>and
>>not after you get airborne! It is rather critical in real life because the
>>approach speed can vary greatly from an empty aircraft to a full one. If 
>>you
>>try landing an empty aircraft at full weight speeds you'll end up far too
>>fast and will float a good way down the runway.
>>
>>You can let the autothrottle manage your airspeed on the ILS down to the
>>point at which you normally switch off the autopilot but you must remember
>>that you need to disconnect it with CTRL + R. What I tend to do these days
>>is let the aircraft settle on the ILS and when everything is nice and 
>>stable
>>(flaps are all down and the speed is correct) I turn the autothrottle off
>>early. If you forget to turn off the autothrottle it can be embarrassing -
>>and you don't usually spot it until you come to round out and find the
>>aircraft isn't slowing down at all. By the time you realise this and hit 
>>the
>>disconnect button it is usually too late to land because you are a good 
>>way
>>down the runway.
>>
>>Hope this helps..
>>
>>bones
>>
>> > -----Original Message-----
>> > From: jhb_airlines-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx=20
>> > [mailto:jhb_airlines-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of=20
>> > ErnieLaycock@xxxxxxx
>> > Sent: 18 October 2004 14:58
>> > To: jhb_airlines@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> > Subject: [jhb_airlines] report 156
>> >=20
>> >=20
>> > Hi again John.
>> > only one assignment this week but lots of practice on 737 at=20
>> > EGGP.My missed =20
>> > approaches have mounted up,but I am slowly getting the knack=20
>> > of it.The speed =20
>> > seems to be my Achilles Heel,but it is coming.I have brought=20
>> > myself back from =20
>> > Jordan:-
>> > OJAM - EGGP 4:50 737 (should have been 4:30,but missed=20
>> > approaches at EGGP =20
>> > made it a bit more).
>> > Local at EGGP 6:20
>> > Total 11:10
>> > Off for more practice now.
>> > Cheers=20
>> > Ernie 156
>> >=20
>> >=20
>
>
>
> 


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