[jhb_airlines] Re: Innsbruck

  • From: "Bones" <bones@xxxxxxx>
  • To: <jhb_airlines@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2005 14:45:46 +0100

ATC may deviate from the IAP but with the airfield effectively in a large
ravine they don't have much flexibility. They can't give you a shortened
final or a premature descent because of the terrain so you will still
probably follow the STAR quite closely - except they may give radar headings
rather than leave navigation up to you.

The approaches aren't really difficult - just unusual. Rwy 26 is the easier
of the two as you just leave RTT NDB on 210 to intercept the ILS. The
difference is that you start at 9500ft until you capture the GS, the
Localiser is offset by 5 degrees and the glideslope slightly steeper than
normal.

Rwy 08 is the trickier one. The stack is KTI NDB and minimum level 13000ft.
You leave this on 104 and descend to 11500ft to capture the ILS. ATC could
give you a steer instead but don't bank on this. Once you intercept the ILS
at 20.4nm you again fly a steep glideslope - speed control will be important
here so I suggest getting back to 180kts before hitting the ILS. Once on the
ILS you descend to 5000ft (at 6.5DME) - and this is where your ILS approach
stops.

This ILS is nothing more than a cloudbreak procedure that puts you overhead
the airfield at 5000ft. The ILS is way up the valley so when you get down to
the 5000ft stop point you have already overflown the airfield (just). If you
are still in cloud you climb like hell on the missed approach procedure -
you don't have an alternative choice except a premature encounter with hard
stuff. Memorise the MAP (heading 066 to 9500ft) because you may need it.

If you are below cloud at 5000ft you turn hard right (max radius of turn is
2nm) back to the airfield for a visual approach - either downwind for 08 or
onto final for 26. You have about 3100ft of height to get off - no problem
for 08 but if you hope for a quick teardrop onto 26 you'll have your work
cut out.

At the minimum you should study the STAR chart, the IAP for 08 and 26 and
also the Visual Approach chart as this shows you what to do when you finish
the ILS at 5000ft and decide to go for the landing. It's all so tight that
ATC have little input - it all comes down to pilot skill. If the overcast
tonight is below 5000ft then it will be interesting to see if anyone tries
to continue the approach.

If you forget to disengage the ILS when you reach 5000ft the aircraft will
still continue to fly the signal. Eventually you will reach the ILS some
10nm or so up the valley from the airfield - if you haven't hit a mountain
en route. The reason for the 5000ft limit is twofold. First it gives you a
decent chance to climb clear of the hills if you have to go around. Second
is that a lower altitude puts you further away from the airfield and in a
narrower valley - making the turn back to the airfield very hairy indeed.

I'd suggest that if you fly the ILS for 08 you tune in ABSAM NDB (313) on
the ADF. If you haven't started the turn back to the airfield when the ADF
needle swings round at ABSAM then forget the approach altogether and go
around. It's about 2nm past the point at which you reach 5000ft on the
descent.

bones

-----Original Message-----
From: jhb_airlines-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:jhb_airlines-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Gerry Winskill
Sent: 13 July 2005 10:10
To: jhb_airlines@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [jhb_airlines] Re: Innsbruck


I tried a departure, this morning,  having read the copious Aerad
instructions. The FSMeteo weather was "interesting", with the mountains
at either side clearly visible. Well, until they disappeared into the
low cloudbase! Following the max gradient climb instructions, the half
fueled A320 got off with a bit in hand, with FSNav set on a SID.  For the
landing, I'd rather hoped that ATC will be helping keep me and
the solid bits apart?

Gerry Winskill
gwinsk@xxxxxxx



Bones wrote:

>Yes but not fully loaded. We've seen a few here with just a 5750ft
>runway.
>
>Just practise your steep turns because if LOWI is in marginal weather
>tomorrow and you do the ILS cloudbreak procedure (descend to 5000ft on
>the ILS and the airfield should be directly underneath you) then you
>have to stay within a circling radius of 2nm of the airport to stop
>thudding into a hillside.
>
>I wonder how many will get caught out by the ILS being 16nm away from
>the airfield... <vbg>
>
>bones
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: jhb_airlines-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>[mailto:jhb_airlines-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Gerry Winskill
>Sent: 12 July 2005 18:42
>To: JHB AIRLINES
>Subject: [jhb_airlines] Innsbruck
>
>
>One of tomorrow's FPI destinations is Innsbruck. Since it's a) closer
>than Vienna and  b) a tricky location, I'll probably have a crack at
>Manchester to Innsbruck, and return. I'd prefer to use the A320,' cos
>it's faster than my normal F100 choice. Innsbruck's runway is 6000'. Is
>the A320 0n?
>
>Gerry Winskill
>gwinsk@xxxxxxx
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>



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