[jhb_airlines] Re: FPI

  • From: "Bones" <bones@xxxxxxx>
  • To: <jhb_airlines@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Thu, 6 Oct 2005 17:37:13 +0100

In a way yes but the ATC side of FPI needs to get better for this to work.
I'll try and explain.

When you are inbound to an airfield the Centre and Approach controllers have
to agree what we call a clearance limit. A good example is from last night
where I wanted all inbounds to be at FL50 by VANIN. The Centre controller
then has to sort the aircraft out so that they descend in time to hit the
fix at the right altitude.

To a pilot he should say "JHB007 is cleared to VANIN at FL50". In the real
world a pilot then knows he is cleared to VANIN (but no further) and he has
to be down at FL50 by that point. The Centre controller should then pass the
aircraft over to APP as soon as possible - certainly not as the aircraft
reaches VANIN. If left too late the poor pilot has no option but to go into
the hold because he needs further clearance to proceed from Approach.

This doesn't happen in FPI because the controllers don't really know the
procedure for handing an aircraft over. When it is quiet it doesn't matter
and mostly they use FL120 as the point at which they throw aircraft to the
next unit. When it gets busier this doesn't work. Last night I suspect Alex
tried to control you all right up to VANIN or KELLY but then got too busy to
hand aircraft over properly. He talked to me about JHB153 but then he just
threw the rest of you over without co-ordination at all - which didn't help.

In real life both Manchester and Ronaldsway would have realised that the
mass of aircraft coming in are an Approach problem and Manchester would have
given us all the aircraft well in advance so that we could sort things out
early. In FPI controllers don't realise that they can do this and they try
to control up to the edge of their airspace. Alex thought that he had no
reason to give aircraft to me until the IOM Zone boundary but he should have
passed them over when still on the airways system. Actual airspace
boundaries are not actually relevant - but FPI controllers think they are
absolutely rigid.

In truth, if it gets busy and you are trying to talk to me then do what we
do in real life. Simply say "JHB188 is with you". It's short, it lets me
know you are on frequency and I'll come back to you as soon as I have time
to give you an instruction.


-----Original Message-----
From: jhb_airlines-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:jhb_airlines-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of franklyn fisher
Sent: 06 October 2005 17:10
To: jhb_airlines@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [jhb_airlines] Re: FPI

perhaps I should ignore the controller and get on with my plan, until I can
get in the call.
Frank F

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