Sometimes I have a feeling they especially don't listen to the people on this list.
I know there are some very knowledgeable Jaws users and programmers here and it is a real shame that FS appears not to here them.
There are also compiled bugs reported here but when you contact FS support, they act as if you are the first to report the problem and work through it as if the problem is on your end. That would be reasonable if it was a one of a kind problem but not when it has been reported so many times on this list.
Anyone volunteer to compile messages about Jaws 11 and send them to FS? NOPE! I'm not standing up to do this. I'm just not that good at organizing my arguments. This will take careful pruning of messages and sticking to facts, not opinions.
It would also be so helpful if we could somehow compile a list of bugs that have crept in over the years that have not been fixed. Plus another list of features that either have been removed or have stopped working right.
I would like this all to be placed on a public web site. It is not good just posting to a list like this because it is so temporal and transitory. Sure, you can always search the archives but that is not a way of presenting these problems in a logical and easy to understand format. Placing this kind of info on a web site with formatted tables and real facts would give people a chance to comment and make corrections. I don't think a forum is a good way to go because again, the information is spread out and not easily indexed. They also seem to attract people who just want to gripe and put people down. I wonder if something like a Wiki would work for collaboration. Maybe there is some other format with accessible software?I'd just like to see something that gets positive results without making anyone defensive. We don't need to go on and on about the past. Just find new ways to move forward and help a good company make a good product even better.
I think some people here might argue about that last paragraph. I might even agree at times. But, the point is screen readers for Windows are not easy to build and maintain. Again, this is not to promote an argument or to run down anyone.
Just throwing out ideas. I sure hope someone wants to get this going. I know there are people here who know how. I'd love to help out but I don't currently have the skills to start this.
Bob----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Durber" <d.durber@xxxxxxxxx>
To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Monday, May 10, 2010 7:55 PM Subject: Re: worst release
Barry: Even if we were to take your suggestion to notify FS, in all the ways you suggest, the question is: 1. Are they listening! or2. do they have their Nelson's ear pointing toward us, so they do not haveto hear us! I get the feeling they stopped listening to their users/customers a very long time ago because, if they were listening, they would concentrate onfixing many of the bugs before moving on and adding more and more features.No point adding more features, if the basic product does not work correctlyin the first place. Unfortunately, this kind of behavior, typifies the attitudes of many software companies today, that is, add more and more feature but, keep the bugs. This is how they can keep you constantly upgrading all the time.Occasionally though, as Microsoft, found out with Vista, customers do bightback once in a while and refuse to get taken for a ride and refuse to be ripped off. Maybe, it is about time FS got a taste of the same medicine! Sincerely: Dave Durber ----- Original Message ----- From: "Barry J. Campbell" <Barry.J.Campbell@xxxxxxxx> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Monday, May 10, 2010 1:15 PM Subject: RE: worst releaseHello: With no disrespect to anyone on this list. I actually find this topicveryinteresting but I wonder if the people complaining about problems withJAWSare sending your suggestions to Freedom Scientific? I am a systemsanalystand keep track of any problems, suggestions for improvement, suggestionsforfuture releases of our applications. posting on this list is fine but thesystems team at FS needs to hear this. Also when you attend the tradeshowsand convensions let Eric and others know your suggestions and criticism's.Just a thought. -----Original Message-----From: jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On BehalfOf Dave Carlson Sent: Monday, May 10, 2010 1:00 PM To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: Re: worst release Yes I agree. I've always wanted support for Pivot Tables in Excel, andthishas never been developed. Dave ----- Original Message ----- From: "Soronel Haetir" <soronel.haetir@xxxxxxxxx> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Monday, May 10, 2010 09:38 Subject: Re: worst release I do find it amazing that they are putting so much focus on research it when there are so many things that flat don't work. That speaks of incredibly messed up priorities. Things like the array and collection support in the script language are much more important in the long run. On 5/10/10, Dave Carlson <dgcarlson@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: > I've said this directly to FS Support in my feedback, that I think JAWSis> becoming a victim of bloatware. It's time that it was stripped down toits> fundamentals, and then allow user selection of "features" during the > install. > > For example I don't use Braille, nor Magi, so I would think that my > preferred "kernel" of JAWS could be an audio-only version to startwith,> and then I add on other things, like additional synthesizers, > additional> voices, ResearchIt, etc. > > If I wanted Braille then I would select that in the install as one ofthe> features I needed. > > I've got to believe that switching to this paradigm would, in the long > run,> save FS one heck of a lot of cost in trying to update, fix, and > maintain> their ever-increasing "Medusa-ware". > > They didn't agree with me. > > My opinions expressed here are mine, and not meant to represent anyother> person or organization But even my dog agrees. > > Dave > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Gerald Levy" <bwaylimited@xxxxxxxxxxx> > To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> > Sent: Monday, May 10, 2010 08:27 > Subject: Re: worst release > > > > Well, if JAWS 11 is bad, can JAWS 12 be even worse? > > Gerald > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Soronel Haetir" <soronel.haetir@xxxxxxxxx> > To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> > Sent: Monday, May 10, 2010 10:08 AM > Subject: Re: worst release > > >>I suspect most of it is jfw11 as 11 hasn't worked for me on either my >> xp or vista systems. >> >> On 5/10/10, Cy Selfridge <cyselfridge@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: >>> Alan, >>>>>> After I sent the message I remembered 4.5 and you are exactly >>> correct.>>> >>> This was long about the time OpenBook came out with the infamous Ruby >>> edition and open Book went completely to Hell. >>> >>> Oh well, there will be times such as these. >>>>>> I did not install JAWS 11 on my XP machine so I don't know how much >>> is>>> JAWS >>> and how much is Winders 7. >>> >>> Cy, The Anasazi >>> >>> From: jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On >>> Behalf >>> Of Alan Dicey >>> Sent: Monday, May 10, 2010 7:39 AM >>> To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >>> Subject: worst release >>> >>> >>> >>> Dear Cy, >>> >>> That was version 4.0! >>> >>> >>> >>> Yes, nothing worked with it at all ! >>> >>> >>> >>> They tryed to improve it with some upgrades, but finally had to comeout>>> with 4.5 ! >>> >>> >>> >>> With Best Regards, >>> >>> Alan >>> >>> Miami, Florida >>> >>> Alan Dicey, President >>> >>> United States Braille Chess Association - USBCA >>> >>> "Yes, Blind or Visually Impaired People Can, and Do, Play Chess!!!" >>> >>> United States Braille Chess Association Home Page: >>> <http://americanblindchess.org/> http://AmericanBlindChess.org >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> >>> From: Cy Selfridge <mailto:cyselfridge@xxxxxxxxxxx> >>> >>> To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >>> >>> Sent: Monday, May 10, 2010 9:26 AM >>> >>> Subject: worst release >>> >>> >>> >>> Hey Ted, >>> >>> After some thought I think I disagree with you about 11 being theworst>>> release. >>> >>> It seems to me that long about 3.5 or 4 there was a release which wasa>>> complete disaster. I can't recall which release exactly it was but >>> almost >>> nothing worked. >>> >>> Cy, The Anasazi >>> >>> >>> >>> From: jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On >>> Behalf >>> Of Lisle, Ted (CHFS DMS) >>> Sent: Monday, May 10, 2010 7:00 AM >>> To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >>> Subject: RE: Just joined, research it question >>> >>> >>> >>> Marvelous, and this is the big gee-whiz reason we're all supposed to >>> switch! >>> This has to be the worst release ever. >>> >>> >>> >>> Ted >>> >>> >>> >>> From: jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On >>> Behalf >>> Of Tom Lange >>> Sent: Saturday, May 08, 2010 12:06 PM >>> To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >>> Subject: Re: Just joined, research it question >>> >>> >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> I tried several locations and varied the syntax slightly; it still >>> didn't >>> work. Even their example "Jackson, MS" didn't. Oh well. >>> >>> >>> >>> Tom >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> >>> From: Cindy Handel <mailto:cindy425@xxxxxxxxxxx> >>> >>> To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >>> >>> Sent: Saturday, May 08, 2010 6:54 AM >>> >>> Subject: Re: Just joined, research it question >>> >>> >>> >>> I just tried that. There must be something wrong with that part of >>> ResearchIt. I didn't get any results, either. >>> >>> >>> >>> Cindy >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> >>> From: Stacey Robinson <mailto:staceyr75@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> >>> >>> To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >>> >>> Sent: Saturday, May 08, 2010 8:19 AM >>> >>> Subject: Just joined, research it question >>> >>> >>> >>> Hello, >>> >>> I just joined this list last night. >>> >>> I just recently (this week) upgraded to Jaws 11. >>>>>> If I enter research it and check weather (which is my primary >>> setting)>>> all >>> is well. >>>>>> If I check time though by entering Nashville, TN. I get no time >>> search>>> found >>> or some such message, what could I be doing wrong. >>> >>> I know the time in Nashville so started there first. (I'm in the same >>> time >>> zone) >>> >>> Nothing I enter in time search brings me any time info. >>> >>> Please help. >>> >>> >>> >>> Have a blessed day, >>> Stacey Robinson and GEB dog Chesley >>> Eagleville, Tennessee. >>> staceyr75@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> Soronel Haetir >> soronel.haetir@xxxxxxxxx >> -- >> JFW related links: >> JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/ >> Scripting mailing list: >> http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com >> JFW List instructions: >> To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to >> jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subjectline.>> Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw >> Alternative archives located at: >> http://n2.nabble.com/JAWS-for-Windows-f2145279.html >> >> If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list,or>> the way the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather >> contact the list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx > > -- > JFW related links: > JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/ > Scripting mailing list: > http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com > JFW List instructions: > To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to> jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject > line.> Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw > Alternative archives located at: > http://n2.nabble.com/JAWS-for-Windows-f2145279.html >> If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list, > or> the > way the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather contact > the > list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx > > -- > JFW related links: > JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/ > Scripting mailing list: > http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com > JFW List instructions: > To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to> jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject > line.> Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw > Alternative archives located at: > http://n2.nabble.com/JAWS-for-Windows-f2145279.html >> If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list, > or> the > way the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather contact > the > list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx > -- Soronel Haetir soronel.haetir@xxxxxxxxx -- JFW related links: JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/ Scripting mailing list: http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com JFW List instructions: To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject line. Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw Alternative archives located at: http://n2.nabble.com/JAWS-for-Windows-f2145279.html If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list, ortheway the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather contactthelist owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx -- JFW related links: JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/ Scripting mailing list: http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com JFW List instructions: To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject line. Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw Alternative archives located at: http://n2.nabble.com/JAWS-for-Windows-f2145279.html If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list, ortheway the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather contactthelist owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx -- JFW related links: JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/ Scripting mailing list:http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.comJFW List instructions: To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message tojfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject line.Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw Alternative archives located at:http://n2.nabble.com/JAWS-for-Windows-f2145279.htmlthe way the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather contactIf you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list, orthe list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx -- JFW related links: JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/Scripting mailing list: http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.comJFW List instructions: To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxxTo unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject line.Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfwAlternative archives located at: http://n2.nabble.com/JAWS-for-Windows-f2145279.htmlIf you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list, or the way the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather contact the list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.comVersion: 9.0.819 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2866 - Release Date: 05/10/10 12:26:00
-- JFW related links: JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/ Scripting mailing list: http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com JFW List instructions: To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject line. Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw Alternative archives located at: http://n2.nabble.com/JAWS-for-Windows-f2145279.html If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list, or the way the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather contact the list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
