Re: authorization issues

  • From: Judith Bron <jbron@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
  • Date: Tue, 08 Jul 2008 17:12:03 -0400

I agree that most government vocational/rehap counselors purchase jaws at the behest of their state commissions. Once you get accustomed to jaws it takes a lot to get another piece of software that you have to start learning all over again. My first copy of jaws was purchased by the state. When I purchased the second copy it was almost a knee jerk reaction to order jaws. Perhaps the other screen reader companies should spend more time soliciting government agencies. Judith ----- Original Message ----- From: "Yardbird" <yardbird@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>

To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2008 4:23 PM
Subject: Re: authorization issues


There are a lot of reasons, Gerald. One, and an important one and very
logical, is that with the exception of some bugs in each release that happen
to affect the majority of the users' computers and thus receive immediate
attention in the development and tech support departments, not everyone has
the same problems or so many problems with Jaws, just depending on the
specifics of their computer, their operating system, the version of Jaws,
and a few other variables.It's not as if Jaws if blowing up everyone's
computers all day. I do happen to have had a lot of difficult stuff happen
with Jaws9, and some other people would understand quite well, but we
probably wouldn't even be having the same problems. Overall, however strange
it sounds to  say it, the program works. Now, if it were a Honda Prelude
instead of a screen reader, there would be a lot of returns and probably a
factory recall several times a year, and a devastating review in Consumer
Reports that might strike the company's death knell. But it isn't a car, and
the distinction makes a difference.

Second, FS is not, I don't think, as savage and cynical as all that. I don't
know why some people feel it is, but I think they're just frustrated  and
humiliated by their dependence on the program by the time they start saying
stuff like that.

Last, and this is economically critical: I think the majority of expensive
adaptive tech equipment like Jaws is bought not with the private disposable funds of all the users, but by state rehabilitation agencies. The funding is
government funding, and it's the kind of situation where once a vendor of
something as unusual and, to all but the initiated, esoteric thing like a
screen reader program (don't forget, all those freebies weren't out there
until recently) and a vendor ingratiates themselves, convinces the agencies
of their product's reliability and utility, it gets approved so that, for
instance at the rehab agency that first bought me jaws when I'd stopped
working at a job I'd had to drive to and use my eyes for, and my income was low,. They didn't ask me. And I couldn't have helped them research something to buy, either. It was all new to me. And Jaws was what was in their stable
already. Sure, if I'd known about Window Eyes  and really had a reason to
request it, I could have lobbied for them to buy it and possibly gotten what
I requested. But usually it doesn't work that way. The applicant for such
help usually is relying on the rehab counselor to know about and provide
these things. I certainly was.

So those are a few things to consider. This isn't a market like other
markets. The same dynamics don't apply.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Gerald Levy" <bwaylimited@xxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2008 12:05 PM
Subject: Re: authorization issues



I haven't dealt with FS tech support, but if what you have experienced is
really true, why would anyone use JAWS, especially since all the other
commercially available screen readers are less expensive?  Not to mention
the ever-growing number of free screen readers like NVDA and Thunder.  So
how does JAWS maintain its position as the leading screen reader? I'm not
defending FS, but if they really do treat their blind and visually impaired
customers with such callous indifference, how do they remain in business?
After all, they are not the domineering monopoly that Microsoft is.



----- Original Message ----- From: "Yardbird" <yardbird@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2008 2:23 PM
Subject: Re: authorization issues


HI Chip,

Just to say I understand exactly the sort of frustrating experiences
you're
describing below, because I've had them myself, more than ever during this
year of Jaws 9, never mind which build. Uninstalling and reinstalling,
over
and over, has never rectified one single problem I've ever called tech
support for help with, and yet they've insisted on my repeating that drill
over and over just as you say. At one point this year, I spent a total of
something close to six hours on the phone, wrote detailed and well
organized
reports on my "issues" and sent them to the top of the tech support
department to be reviewed before someone from Tier 2 called me, but in a
couple of cases, the reps who were assigned to call me either weren't
given
my report to look at (which the head guy who shall remain unnamed) had
emphasized to me how important and valuable my taking the time to make
such
reports would be to them) or had received it but hadn't read it, and began from nothing. In one case, I insisted that the guy just sit there and read
my report while I waited, paying for long distance. That gfew cents was
worth less than my time. of course, despite the intervening minutes of
discussion, most of what we wound up doing was me being led by the hand to
uninstall and reinstall five different ways, as if it always had to be
some
glitch I'd introduced by improperly installing and configuring jaws. Like
hell. What is it, a Model you've got to know how to practically rebuild
all
by yourself in your own garage or have a chauffer trained as a mechanic if
you want to drive one? That's a rhetorical question.

anyway, I manage to survive with all the glitches and bugs that remain for
me, and I have to admit I'm grateful for it working as well as it does,
because it enable me in a way that still astonishes me and fills me with
gratitude compared to the despair I felt when I began to lose my ability
to
see clearly enough and read a little over ten years ago. So part of me
still
feels as if it's a gift and a miracle.

But the complaints are real, nonetheless. And if I had the money to spend,
I'd consider jumping ship, too, but I can't deal with that, financially.
And
life will go on, not all that badly despite my annoyance.

Which is a long-winded way of pumping my fist in the air and yelling "you
go, boy!"

Joel
desite juming graatiude rebuilt configuitng configuing nd imporperly
intalling instlling intduced intereducesbine gntohing.at repeated
yo[exseyou're describing
----- Original Message ----- From: "Chip Orange" <Corange@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2008 6:32 AM
Subject: RE: authorization issues


Thanks Cher, but that really sounds like a problem with an early build
of jaws 9.  If uac caused problems in jaws, we'd all certainly know of
it by now.

I am very reluctant to get on the phone with jaws tech support again.
I've spent many hours reinstalling everything for them on the last
problem I reported.  Reinstallations seems to be their *only*
trouble-shooting measure.  When I asked for the problem to be escalated,
the person I was working with said "no", because he was the escalation
he said.

It seems every time I had done a reinstallation I hadn't done it quite
right according to him (you didn't delete the directory afterwards using
narrator; you didn't also uninstall and reinstall the video driver; you
did a repair when a uninstall and reinstall would have been better,
etc.).

After going through many calls like that I finally stopped calling.  I'm
now requisitioning Window Eyes from my employer.  When it comes, with
it's new scripting feature with vba as it's language, I'm going to
switch.  I've already gotten much better pre-sales tech support from GW
Micro than I've ever gotten from FS.

Sorry for the soapbox, I'll get off now and will try not to climb back
on.

Anyone who's really dedicated to jaws is free to pass this along to the
head of their tech support and/or sales; it's fine to let them know
they've lost at least one customer to poor quality tech support, and to
better tech support from a competitor who hadn't even sold me a product
yet.

And, as icing on the cake, they don't have any such copy-protection, so
no authorization issues to deal with!!! Hooorrraaayyyy!!!!!  (that's my
current problem I just posted about solved!)

And, no difference in versions, so no "professional" version to deal
with for certain versions of the operating system!!!!!
Hooorrraaayyyyy!!!!!

Chip







------------------------------

Chip Orange
Database Administrator
Florida Public Service Commission

Chip.Orange@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
(850) 413-6314

(Any opinions expressed are solely those of the author and do not
necessarily reflect those of the Florida Public Service Commission.)





________________________________

From: jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
On Behalf Of Cher Bosch
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2008 9:08 AM
To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: authorization issues


Not exactly the same, but similar... On a Lonova ThinkPad I set
up last fall with VISTA home (premium, I think) and the first build of
JAWS9, we ended up having to disable UAC to keep JAWS from switching
into demo mode.  If I remember, evrytime UAC came up, JAWS switched to
demo.

Cher



"Chip Orange" <Corange@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> 7/7/2008 10:05 AM


Hi all,

On my vista laptop I've noticed that if I switch from my
wireless nic to my wired nic, my jaws authorization suddenly switches
into demo mode.  If I update it while using the wired nic until it's a
registered copy  again, then when I switch back to my wireless nic it's
an unregistered demo copy again.

Has anyone seen this happen?  On my thinkpad laptop, which was
running xp and an earlier version of jaws, I frequently switched between
wired and wireless without a problem, so I'm guessing this is related to
the latest build or vista, and was just wondering if anyone else is
seeing this?

thanks.

Chip







------------------------------

Chip Orange
Database Administrator
Florida Public Service Commission

Chip.Orange@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
(850) 413-6314

(Any opinions expressed are solely those of the author and do
not necessarily reflect those of the Florida Public Service Commission.)





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