Re: Word maximize and zoom (was Re: Jaws 7.10 not speaking the whole word)
- From: "Yardbird" <yardbird@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2006 18:51:44 -0700
I am glad you have a handle on your own experience with Word. But I've been
using Word and Jaws together since Jaws 3.7, and never did I have to
maximize Word or change the default zoom setting away from normal 100 per
cent, Neither did I ever find items in the View menu changing themselves
without my doing something purposely. And for several version, in my
experience, it has made no difference to Jaws whether a document is
displaying in Print view or Normal view. It seems a very long time since
this mattered.
And the other problems you say people have aren't familiar to me, either. I
also am only observing, but I stress that what I'm describing is my
experience of about seven years during which I've used Jaws in all those
versions since 3.7, several different versions of Word, on three different
computers, and under Windows 98 SE and Windows XP Home. I do consider
myself very fortunate not to have experienced the frustrating issues you
mention. but I can't easily imagine what they might gbe caused by, and
imagine it may be something other than the configuration of Word, which
ordinarily works fine with Jaws in its most standard configuration, out of
the box, if you make sure to do certain things like anchor or delete
floating tool bars that may confound Jaws, and actually little else. Again,
I'm grateful not to have these mystifying problems to deal with. Hope you
find ways to understand and resolve most of them eventually. The period
during which I did have to hassle with a lot of maddening problems with Jaws
was when I still wanted to try to make some visual sense of the screen
elements, and like many low vision people, changed the Windows display from
standard to white text on a black background, even as I began to use Jaws to
help me understand what was getting permanently out of focus. In early
versions, I had to twist the arms of Henter tech support people to tell me
how to modify certain files to let Jaws make sense of the screen this way,
as I say a common adjustment used by many low vision people, and then using
the built-in facility in later versions to supposedly adjust jaws to this
scheme. It never worked very well, and getting Jaws to focus as it should
was really difficult and required innumerable little tweaks of all sorts.
But it's fine, now. Just trying to say I know about frustration with Jaws.
thatbof ----From: "Dale Leavens" <dleavens@xxxxxxx>
To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Thursday, October 12, 2006 6:16 PM
Subject: Re: Word maximize and zoom (was Re: Jaws 7.10 not speaking the
whole word)
I am not certain but I think that there have been improvements in the way
Jaws works with Word in recent releases.
I find now for example that in print view Word works well for me and it
didn't used to. Under normal view it was also necessary to set zoom to 75%
to get Jaws to read it correctly. This no longer seems to be necessary.
One confounding factor I have discovered is Windows way of changing settings
for some mysterious reason and occasionally certain controls and other menu
bars appear for no apparent reason. These will often confuse Jaws. Many of
these happen in the View menu in my experience.
Regardless of the visual representation and how you or anyone else might
think it should appear, Jaws doesn't always see the screen or at least
interpret it in the obvious way.
This is not an explanation, it is an observation. I use Word daily at work
for purposes of documentation and I am always in a hurry so these
frustrations drive me nuts. I should just sit there and figure it all out
when it happens but I need to get my notes out and on to the next task so I
just fiddle settings until I get it working and promise I will figure out
how and why this stuff happens another time. I suspect some of it is the
template under which certain documents are created which hijack the
environment but I really don't know.
I do want to assure other users though that they are not imagining the
behavior when they can't read or write or format things in word with Jaws as
they anticipate.
Dale Leavens, Cochrane Ontario Canada
DLeavens@xxxxxxx
Skype DaleLeavens
Come and meet Aurora, Nakita and Nanook at our polar bear habitat.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Yardbird" <yardbird@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Thursday, October 12, 2006 8:16 PM
Subject: Re: Word maximize and zoom (was Re: Jaws 7.10 not speaking the
whole word)
> Kelly,
>
> I knew that the Word version of maximization from those controls or that
> little menu was not like maximizing using the View menu in IE. I was just
> giving an example of something similar. sorry it wasn't a good
> comparison.
> As I said, I've used Word for years, first without Jaws and now with it,
> and
> always run it in a normal window. I repeat that I have no idea why this
> idea of maximizing application interfaces the way you describe is
> recommended so often. I've never heard such advice except on mailing
> lists
> when someone's having a problem, and each time, I try to imagine what
> someone thinks they mean. I wonder if they think that Word normally would
> present itself in some sort of miniature window or something, which I've
> never known to happen. What can I say about that.
>
> As for the zoom deal, I didn't say it wouldn't make any difference to Jaws
> if you fooled around with it in a way that flummoxed Jaws. But again, in
> my
> long experience, you don't have to do one single thing to that setting.
> Just leave it normal, which is 100 per cent. No reduction, no
> magnification. It works just fine. again, I don't know where this Jaws
> idea comes from. Maybe it's from long ago, many Jaws versions ago, when
> someone trained someone to do this thing? I know that all my Word text is
> always just fine when displayed perfectly normally. Of course, if I
> magnify
> it to 200 per cent, it's going to screw up Jaws. That doesn't contradict
> what I'm saying about normal being just fine.
>
> there's something here I'm not getting, and I think it would take someone
> with a different background, say as a trainer or a troubleshooter, to
> explain how these two recommendations got started and became conventional
> wisdom.
>
> Sorry. Not trying to change your mind. Just happened to know from my own
> experience what I know, for my own successful Jaws usage.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Kelly Hill" <khill@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Thursday, October 12, 2006 4:26 PM
> Subject: Re: Word maximize and zoom (was Re: Jaws 7.10 not speaking the
> whole word)
>
>
> Yardbird,
> The maximize I am talking about is the maximize symbol that appears on the
> title bar and in the system menu once Word or any other program is
> running.
> Perhaps the item in the view menu of Microsoft Explorer to which you refer
> is the option for full screen. That would almost certainly expand the
> webpage portion to push the menu bar off of the screen.
>
> The zoom feature in the view menu of Word controls how the document looks
> on
> screen and to my knowledge has no affect on how your document will print.
> If you think Zoom has no affect, try setting it to 200% and reading a
> document.
>
> I'm still curious why this person's Jaws was only reading partial words.
> Perhaps the font was really huge.
>
>
> Kelly
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Yardbird" <yardbird@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Friday, October 06, 2006 4:04 PM
> Subject: Word maximize and zoom (was Re: Jaws 7.10 not speaking the whole
> word)
>
>
>> I've heard this advice about the zoom setting so often, and maximization
>> as
>> well, that I would like to offer my own experience with Jaws, over
>> several
>> versions, on several computers, and with several editions of Word.
>>
>> First of all, maximization. If you go into the properties for the Start
>> Menu icon or the hotkey combination you use to launch Word, you'll see
>> among the items a choice of having it run normal or maximized. And
>> normal
>> really means normal. Word running this way fills the screen, from top to
>> bottom and from left to right. I've never tried setting it to the
>> Maximized
>> option and observed what happens then (I'm partially sighted so can
>> actually
>> observe this sort of thing), but I know from the one time I set Internet
>> Explorer to run maximized, using the View menu option, it had the
>> unfortunate effect of pushing the menu bar off the screen to make room
>> for
>> even more of the main window, which wasn't necessary for any practical
>> reason and of course made it impossible to use IE's menu commands. Not
>> very
>> practical. And it didn't have any effect on Jaws, at all. Good or bad.
>> As
>> I say, I don't know what running maxed would do to Word, but I've never
>> run
>> it that way, and so far as I know, it's not necessary. Normal is just
>> fine.
>> Normal is normal. Honestly, normal doesn't mean Word is displaying in a
>> reduced-sized window that's confusing jaws by letting it see things
>> around
>> the Word document. That isn't what normal does. Normal fills the
>> screen.
>> I have no idea where this idea about maximizing Word comes from. Maybe
>> it's
>> extrapolated from other applications, which may open smaller than full
>> size
>> and need to be expanded fully for the sake of Jaws. I don't know.
>>
>> And as for the Zoom to 75 per cent thing, that, too, makes no sense to
>> me.
>> I just looked at my Word View menu in the Zoom option,, and it's set to
>> 100
>> per cent as it always has been for me. This, too, is simply normal. I
>> think
>> it would take an FS tech person to explain to me how this recommendation
>> ever came to be given to Jaws users.
>>
>> As I say, these are my own experiences, as a seasoned Jaws user with
>> Word.
>> Just for comparison.
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Kelly Hill" <khill@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> Sent: Friday, October 06, 2006 3:42 PM
>> Subject: Re: Jaws 7.10 not speaking the whole word
>>
>>
>> If your Word window is maximized, zoom is set to 75% and you are in
>> normal
>> view,
>> you have no tool bars other than standard and formatting displayed and
>> you
>> have set all your Windows XP settings to match the Jaws help topic
>> "Windows
>> XP and Jaws," I'll be very interested to know what the problem is when
>> you
>> find out.
>>
>>
>> Kelly Hill
>>
>> And thi8s only happens in Word?
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Larry Stansifer" <larrys@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> To: <Recipient list suppressed>
>> Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 6:16 PM
>> Subject: Jaws 7.10 not speaking the whole word
>>
>>
>>> Hi Folks,
>>>
>>> I am using JFW 7.10, Windows-XP and Microsoft office XP-pro.
>>>
>>> When creating or editing a document in word Jaws doesn't always speak
>>> the
>>> entire word. Their doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason to what part
>>> of
>>> the word Jaws ignores or how often it does it.
>>> Screen is refreshed, all ms-word are set to FS recommended, both
>>> application and document windows are maximized and all of my Windows-XP
>>> settings are correct.
>>>
>>> This isn't a critical flaw but is certainly a pain in the 32nd
>>> Vertebrae.
>>> Having already ruled out sledge hammer 1.0 I am open to any other
>>> suggestions.
>>>
>>>
>>> Regards
>>>
>>> Larry Stansifer
>>>
>>> Toll Free 1 (800)-527-9572
>>> Voice: 1 (435)-688-1391
>>> Fax: 1 (435) 628-6981
>>> Email: larrys@xxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>
>>>
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>>
>>
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>
>
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