Re: Paying for skipped versions of jaws; was "the virtual ribbon"
- From: "Farfar Carlson" <dgcarlson@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Fri, 27 May 2011 09:06:27 -0700
Kimsan,
Rather than guess, just give FS Sales a call and ask. It's a no-risk
proposition.
800-444-4443
Dave
Composed on a Dell Latitude 630 in the general vicinity of my Audio
Recording and Mixing Studios, San Francisco Bay Area.
----- Original Message -----
From: "kimsan" <kimsansong@xxxxxxx>
To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Friday, May 27, 2011 8:35
Subject: RE: Paying for skipped versions of jaws; was "the virtual ribbon"
That would be after its released right?
I hear if you purchase the SMA earlier, it might be cheeper.
Either way I look at it, I will not be able to afford it for several months.
I just wanted to get some sort of clarification. I am here in the states as
well, btw.
-----Original Message-----
From: jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf
Of Drew Hunthausen
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2011 4:32 PM
To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: Paying for skipped versions of jaws; was "the virtual ribbon"
This is correct at least in the United States. I just purchased my SMA
yesterday.
-----Original Message-----
From: jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf
Of kimsan
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2011 8:10 AM
To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: Paying for skipped versions of jaws; was "the virtual ribbon"
280 and this will cover 13 and 14? I guess I could call and find out huh?
-----Original Message-----
From: jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf
Of inthane
Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2011 11:44 PM
To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: Paying for skipped versions of jaws; was "the virtual ribbon"
buy a sma, paying for jaws is about a grand... a sma is 250 dollars for two
years or so, well 280 for a late buy
elf
. Moderator, Blind Access Help.
. Owner: Alacorn Computer Enterprises
"own the might and majesty of an alacorn"
www.alacorncomputer.com
. proprietor: Inthane's Grab Bag
for blind computer users and Programmers!
http://grabbag.alacorncomputer.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "kimsan" <kimsansong@xxxxxxx>
To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2011 12:16 PM
Subject: RE: Paying for skipped versions of jaws; was "the virtual ribbon"
> How much is it to purchase jfw anyways? I ran out of SMA's.
> I'm gunna try and stay up to date.
> I hope its not an arm and a leg because if it is. I am S.O.L cuzz the
> pay here at the school district sucks lol.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
> Behalf Of Drew Hunthausen
> Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2011 12:05 PM
> To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: RE: Paying for skipped versions of jaws; was "the virtual ribbon"
>
> I think there are valid points on both sides of the argument. All I
> have to say is that Freedom Scientific has made some bad Jaws upgrades
> that cost us money, but with the relatively small blind population,
> they need to put paid upgrades out so that they can have the funding
> to keep improving the product. Otherwise there wouldn't be money to
> make the good upgrades that we all like. Just my two sense worth
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
> Behalf Of Karen Hughes
> Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2011 11:53 AM
> To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: Re: Paying for skipped versions of jaws; was "the virtual ribbon"
>
> tim, my point exactly. the upgrades are just a money grab and we the
> blind are victims of this highway robbery. karen
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Tim" <tim@xxxxxxxxxx>
> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2011 11:39 AM
> Subject: Re: Paying for skipped versions of jaws; was "the virtual ribbon"
>
>
>> But are the upgrades for JAWS really significant upgrades? From what
>> I have heard there was virtually nothing worth upgrading to version 12
for.
>> A new version is put out every year which seems a bit much in my opinion.
>> I think Freedom Scientific is doing this to its customers simply
>> because it can. Put quite simply: if you can take someone's money why
>> stop at only
>
>> taking some of their money. Freedom Scientific wants to see lots of
>> dollars falling from the money tree which they seem to think I have
>> growing in my backyard. This chosen method of doing sales along with
>> the reauthorization code nightmare foisted upon its customers have
>> caused me to switch to Window Eyes. Now I am truly free and quite happy
about it.
>>
>> Tim
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Marquette, Ed" <Ed.Marquette@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2011 9:37 AM
>> Subject: Paying for skipped versions of jaws; was "the virtual ribbon"
>>
>>
>> Before we indict JAWS for predation against the blind, we probably
>> should step back a little. Freedom Scientific's practice of
>> requiring all interim versions to be brought up to date is not
>> uncommon at all in vertical markets. Oracle does essentially the
>> same thing. So long as the
>
>> customer has a "maintenance agreement" in effect, the customer gets
>> upgrades for free -- plus technical support.
>> Once the maintenance agreement lapses, to get the current version,
>> there is a "catch-up" payment required. In fact, that's pretty much
>> standard in
>
>> vertical market software.
>> I'm using the term "vertical market software" to mean something other
>> than
>
>> off-the-shelf shrink-wrap-licensed software like Microsoft Office.
>> Even Microsoft Office has a vertical market type model for enterprise
>> customers.
>> So, I think the real argument is not whether Freedom Scientific is
>> preying
>
>> on the blind, as one might be led to believe, but rather whether the
>> vertical market model or the off-the-shelf model for software
>> licensing is
>
>> more appropriate.
>> I'm not trying to defend anyone; just trying to be fair to all.
>>
>> As long as you
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
>> Behalf
>
>> Of Karen Hughes
>> Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2011 8:52 AM
>> To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Subject: Re: the virtual ribbon
>>
>> cy I agree with you and believe the blind are being penalized big
>> time. I ask myself, would a seeing person put up with this. why could
>> you not just purchase the current version. why do you have to pay for
>> older versions you did not even want or need. Karen
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Cy Selfridge" <cyselfridge@xxxxxxxxxxx>
>> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2011 8:28 AM
>> Subject: RE: the virtual ribbon
>>
>>
>>> It is funny that FS handles Open Book updates differently.
>>> Regardless of how many versions you are behind the cost is, I
>>> believe, only
>>> $150 to get current.
>>> Several years ago I had to bring my JAWS up to date and I think it
>>> was something like $500.
>>> What a bunch of nonsense.
>>> Cy
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
>>> Behalf Of Karen Hughes
>>> Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2011 6:15 AM
>>> To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> Subject: Re: the virtual ribbon
>>>
>>> i too did not update so thought i would not have to pay for
>>> something i did not use. found out different when charged four
>>> hundred and fifty dollars.
>>> i
>>> had to pay for the new update plus the ones i did not use. buyer beware.
>>> who
>>>
>>> said life was fair. karen
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Dawn Thullen" <gdandet@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>> Sent: Monday, May 23, 2011 11:18 PM
>>> Subject: Re: the virtual ribbon
>>>
>>>
>>>>I strongly urge you to buy the SMA if at all possible. I skipped a
>>>>version
>>>
>>>>and the cost was ridiculous. Don't forget, the more versions you
>>>>skip, the
>>>
>>>>more money it costs. As freedomscientific told me "just because you
>>>>didn't
>>>
>>>>upgrade, didn't mean that technology didn't move on."
>>>>
>>>> Dawn
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: "Farfar Carlson" <dgcarlson@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> Sent: Monday, May 23, 2011 5:38 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: the virtual ribbon
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Alan,
>>>>>
>>>>> You'll likely wait until you're in a pine box if you hope to get
>>>>> the bugs out. Cynically speaking (as I'm always reluctant to do)
>>>>> each new version will have new bugs and some old bugs remaining,
>>>>> ad infinitum .
>>>>>
>>>>> And in case you're not aware, failure to renew an SMA before a
>>>>> major version comes out will cost you a whole heck of a lot more
>>>>> money. I'll let other chime in on their experience. My advice is
>>>>> to purchase the SMA for 12 and
>>>
>>>>> 13
>>>>> and wait for 13. I skipped version 10, for example, as it made me ill.
>>>>>
>>>>> Dave
>>>>> Composed on a Dell Latitude 630 in the general vicinity of my Audio
>>>>> Recording and Mixing Studios, San Francisco Bay Area.
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>> From: "Alan Dicey" <adicey@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>> Sent: Monday, May 23, 2011 14:20
>>>>> Subject: the virtual ribbon
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Dear Kenny,
>>>>> Thanks very much for that kind offer, but I only have JAWS 11.
>>>>>
>>>>> I suppose I need to look at getting JAWS 12, but since I do not have
>>>>> any
>>>>> more SMA's, and I am hoping they will get all the bugs out of that
>>>>> version
>>>>> before I purchase it, well I will wait a bit more!
>>>>> Besides, I understand that the "virtual ribbon" is not a total "fix",
>>>>> it
>>>>> only helps out a bit, is that correct?
>>>>>
>>>>> Wow, I have been using the JAWS Menu bars since 1999, with JAWS 3.3!
>>>>>
>>>>> And although I feel I am making a little progress getting the hang of
>>>>> it,
>>>
>>>>> I
>>>>> see it will be a slow learning curb!
>>>>> A completely different thing!
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks again!
>>>>>
>>>>> With Best Regards,
>>>>> Alan
>>>>> Miami, Florida
>>>>> Alan Dicey, President
>>>>> United States Braille Chess Association - USBCA
>>>>> "Yes, Blind and Visually Impaired People, Can, and Do, Play Chess!"
>>>>> United States Braille Chess Association Home Page:
>>>>> http://AmericanBlindChess.org
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>> From: "Kenny Peyatt" <p.wildcat1234@xxxxxxxxx>
>>>>> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>> Sent: Monday, May 23, 2011 3:51 PM
>>>>> Subject: the virtual ribbon
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi allan The virtual ribbon is a jaws 12 feature. To turn it on in
>>>>>> jaws
>>>>>> 12
>>>>>> You go to the setttings center. If you like I can connect to your
>>>>>> computer
>>>>>> through jaws tandom and activate the feature for you.
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> JFW related links:
>>>>>> JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/
>>>>>> Scripting mailing list:
>>>>>> http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com
>>>>>> JFW List instructions:
>>>>>> To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
>>>>>> jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject
>>>>>> line.
>>>>>> Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw
>>>>>> Alternative archives located at:
>>>>>> http://n2.nabble.com/JAWS-for-Windows-f2145279.html
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list,
>>>>>> or
>>>>>> the way the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather
>>>>>> contact the list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> JFW related links:
>>>>> JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/
>>>>> Scripting mailing list:
>>>>> http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com
>>>>> JFW List instructions:
>>>>> To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
>>>>> jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject
>>>>> line.
>>>>> Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw
>>>>> Alternative archives located at:
>>>>> http://n2.nabble.com/JAWS-for-Windows-f2145279.html
>>>>>
>>>>> If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list,
>>>>> or
>>>>> the
>>>>> way the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather
>>>>> contact
>>>>> the
>>>>> list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> JFW related links:
>>>>> JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/
>>>>> Scripting mailing list:
>>>>> http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com
>>>>> JFW List instructions:
>>>>> To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
>>>>> jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject
>>>>> line.
>>>>> Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw
>>>>> Alternative archives located at:
>>>>> http://n2.nabble.com/JAWS-for-Windows-f2145279.html
>>>>>
>>>>> If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list,
>>>>> or
>>>>> the way the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather
>>>>> contact the list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> JFW related links:
>>>> JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/
>>>> Scripting mailing list:
>>>> http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com
>>>> JFW List instructions:
>>>> To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
>>>> jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject
>>>> line.
>>>> Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw
>>>> Alternative archives located at:
>>>> http://n2.nabble.com/JAWS-for-Windows-f2145279.html
>>>>
>>>> If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list,
>>>> or
>>>> the way the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather
>>>> contact the list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>
>>> --
>>> JFW related links:
>>> JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/
>>> Scripting mailing list:
>>> http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com
>>> JFW List instructions:
>>> To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
>>> jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject line.
>>> Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw
>>> Alternative archives located at:
>>> http://n2.nabble.com/JAWS-for-Windows-f2145279.html
>>>
>>> If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list, or
>>> the
>>> way the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather contact
>>> the
>>> list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>
>>> --
>>> JFW related links:
>>> JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/
>>> Scripting mailing list:
>>> http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com
>>> JFW List instructions:
>>> To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
>>> jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject line.
>>> Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw
>>> Alternative archives located at:
>>> http://n2.nabble.com/JAWS-for-Windows-f2145279.html
>>>
>>> If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list, or
>>> the way the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather
>>> contact the list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>
>> --
>> JFW related links:
>> JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/
>> Scripting mailing list:
>> http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com
>> JFW List instructions:
>> To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
>> jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject line.
>> Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw
>> Alternative archives located at:
>> http://n2.nabble.com/JAWS-for-Windows-f2145279.html
>>
>> If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list, or
>> the way the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather
>> contact the list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>
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############################################################################
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>> --
>> JFW related links:
>> JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/
>> Scripting mailing list:
>> http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com
>> JFW List instructions:
>> To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
>> jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject line.
>> Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw
>> Alternative archives located at:
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>>
>> If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list, or
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>>
>>
>
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> ----
>>
>>
>>
>> No virus found in this incoming message.
>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>> Version: 9.0.901 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3655 - Release Date: 05/23/11
>> 01:35:00
>>
>> --
>> JFW related links:
>> JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/
>> Scripting mailing list:
>> http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com
>> JFW List instructions:
>> To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
>> jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject line.
>> Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw
>> Alternative archives located at:
>> http://n2.nabble.com/JAWS-for-Windows-f2145279.html
>>
>> If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list, or
>> the way the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather
>> contact the list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>
> --
> JFW related links:
> JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/
> Scripting mailing list:
> http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com
> JFW List instructions:
> To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
> jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject line.
> Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw
> Alternative archives located at:
> http://n2.nabble.com/JAWS-for-Windows-f2145279.html
>
> If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list, or
> the
> way the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather contact
> the
> list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> -----
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 10.0.1375 / Virus Database: 1509/3657 - Release Date: 05/24/11
>
> --
> JFW related links:
> JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/
> Scripting mailing list:
> http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com
> JFW List instructions:
> To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
> jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject line.
> Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw
> Alternative archives located at:
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>
> If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list, or
> the
> way the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather contact
> the
> list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>
> --
> JFW related links:
> JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/
> Scripting mailing list:
> http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com
> JFW List instructions:
> To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
> jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject line.
> Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw
> Alternative archives located at:
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>
> If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list, or
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> contact the list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
--
JFW related links:
JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/
Scripting mailing list:
http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com
JFW List instructions:
To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
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Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw
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If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list, or the
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To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
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If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list, or the
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list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
-----
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 10.0.1375 / Virus Database: 1509/3659 - Release Date: 05/25/11
--
JFW related links:
JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/
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To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
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If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list, or the
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To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
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