RTFM man, RTFM....lol -----Original Message----- From: isapros-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:isapros-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Thomas W Shinder Sent: Monday, May 22, 2006 8:04 PM To: isapros@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [isapros] Re: MSDE Ram Rule of Thumb I'm willing to give it a try -- but haven't a clue on how to implement it. :) Thomas W Shinder, M.D. Site: www.isaserver.org Blog: http://blogs.isaserver.org/shinder/ Book: http://tinyurl.com/3xqb7 MVP -- ISA Firewalls > -----Original Message----- > From: isapros-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > [mailto:isapros-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Thor (Hammer of > God) > Sent: Monday, May 22, 2006 4:19 PM > To: isapros@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > Subject: [isapros] Re: MSDE Ram Rule of Thumb > > I'm wondering if this may be a candidate for you to upgrade your MSDE > to SQL Express. > > SQL Express manages memory much better than MSDE-- on my system, it > currently only uses 1.6 Meg of RAM. IOW, it's not waiting for another > app to ask for the RAM if it doesn't need it. > > Anybody willing to give this one a go? I can't do it on SBS but I can > try it on an ISA 2004 install and see how it goes... > > t > > > On 5/22/06 12:06 PM, "Amy Babinchak" <amy@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> > spoketh to all: > > > You've described the problem exactly. Where's the guidance? > > > > Amy > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: isapros-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > [mailto:isapros-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] > > On Behalf Of Thor (Hammer of God) > > Sent: Monday, May 22, 2006 2:17 PM > > To: isapros@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > > Subject: [isapros] Re: MSDE Ram Rule of Thumb > > > > Yes, other than the last post Jim sent out. Apparently there is an > > issue where sometimes MSDN does NOT give it back. But then again, we > > don't know if the OS is even asking for it back. The KB doesn't > > really > go into *why* > > it > > happens (it could be the way ISA is asking for memory for > that matter) > > but > > it does specify how to limit the memory. > > > > But that just adds (I assume) to Amy's frustration as even in the > > presence of an article that identifies an issue with MSDE memory and > how to limit > > it > > there is no direction or indication of exactly what to > limit it _to_ and > > under what circumstances. The last bit about "Note The > optimum physical > > memory allocation for SQL Server may vary for your system" > seems to be > > some > > what of a cop-out. > > > > t > > > > > > On 5/22/06 10:47 AM, "Thomas W Shinder" > <tshinder@xxxxxxxxxxx> spoketh > > to > > all: > > > >> Well then, that is good news and argues for the NON-need > to tweak the > >> MSDE Max memory. Right? > >> > >> Thomas W Shinder, M.D. > >> Site: www.isaserver.org > >> Blog: http://blogs.isaserver.org/shinder/ > >> Book: http://tinyurl.com/3xqb7 > >> MVP -- ISA Firewalls > >> > >> > >> > >>> -----Original Message----- > >>> From: isapros-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > >>> [mailto:isapros-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Thor (Hammer of > >>> God) > >>> Sent: Monday, May 22, 2006 11:05 AM > >>> To: isapros@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > >>> Subject: [isapros] Re: MSDE Ram Rule of Thumb > >>> > >>> Right. MSDE fires up and grabs as much memory as it thinks it > >>> needs from the OS. Other apps fire up, and ask the OS "dude, you > >>> got any good memory for me?" and the OS gives it to them if > >>> available. If it needs more than it has, the OS will ask MSDE for > >>> some memory back. MSDE, > since it was > >>> developed to play nice with memory, will comply. Note that all > >>> apps do not do this- but MSDE does. > >>> > >>> t > >>> > >>> > >>> On 5/22/06 8:47 AM, "Jim Harrison" <Jim@xxxxxxxxxxxx> > spoketh to all: > >>> > >>>> The problem is; other programs ask Windows, not other apps > >>> for memory > >>>> allocations. > >>>> If process A owns 512MB of 1GB and process wants 640MB, > >>> process B will get a > >>>> failure response from Windows. > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> ------------------------------------------------------- > >>>> Jim Harrison > >>>> MCP(NT4, W2K), A+, Network+, PCG > >>>> http://isaserver.org/Jim_Harrison/ > >>>> http://isatools.org > >>>> Read the help / books / articles! > >>>> ------------------------------------------------------- > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> -----Original Message----- > >>>> From: isapros-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > >>> [mailto:isapros-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On > >>>> Behalf Of Thomas W Shinder > >>>> Sent: Monday, May 22, 2006 08:14 > >>>> To: isapros@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > >>>> Subject: [isapros] Re: MSDE Ram Rule of Thumb > >>>> > >>>> Hi Jim, > >>>> > >>>> But do you know if the MSDE instance will release memory to > >>> other processes > >>>> that require it? Or is it a 'grab and hold' operation? > >>>> > >>>> Thomas W Shinder, M.D. > >>>> Site: www.isaserver.org > >>>> Blog: http://blogs.isaserver.org/shinder/ > >>>> Book: http://tinyurl.com/3xqb7 > >>>> MVP -- ISA Firewalls > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>> -----Original Message----- > >>>>> From: isapros-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > >>>>> [mailto:isapros-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Jim Harrison > >>>>> Sent: Monday, May 22, 2006 9:17 AM > >>>>> To: isapros@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > >>>>> Subject: [isapros] Re: MSDE Ram Rule of Thumb > >>>>> > >>>>> Yep - this has been "in the wild" for some time now. > >>>>> What we don't have (and a reasonable request) is how to > >>> correlate ISA > >>>>> logging load with MSDE memory requirements. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> -----Original Message----- > >>>>> From: isapros-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > >>>>> [mailto:isapros-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] > >>>>> On Behalf Of Steve Moffat > >>>>> Sent: Monday, May 22, 2006 7:02 AM > >>>>> To: isapros@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > >>>>> Subject: [isapros] Re: MSDE Ram Rule of Thumb > >>>>> > >>>>> I bow to your superior knowledge...J > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> I came across this. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> Well it turns out that the max server memory setting in > >>> MSDE (and SQL) > >>>>> defaults to 2147483647Mb!! A little more digging and I > found a SQL > >>>>> script to change this memory. Copy the following into > >>> notepad and save > >>>>> as sqlmemorylimit.sql . > >>>>> > >>>>> USE master > >>>>> EXEC sp_configure 'show advanced options', 1 RECONFIGURE > >>> WITH OVERRIDE > >>>>> > >>>>> USE master > >>>>> EXEC sp_configure 'max server memory (MB)', 64 RECONFIGURE WITH > >>>>> OVERRIDE > >>>>> > >>>>> USE master > >>>>> EXEC sp_configure 'show advanced options', 0 RECONFIGURE > >>> WITH OVERRIDE > >>>>> > >>>>> With this SQL script saved we can now run it with the following > >>>>> command. > >>>>> > >>>>> osql -E -S servername\MSFW -i c:\sqlmemorylimit.sql > >>>>> > >>>>> This will set the memory limit for MSDE to 64MB. Now you > >>> are probably > >>>>> thinking that 64MB is awefully low, and you are right. > The box in > >>>>> question only had 256MB ram, however I would suggest to > set this to > >>>>> 1/4 of the total amount of physical memory. As an example, > >>> if you have > >>>>> 1GB of memory, set this to 256MB. > >>>>> > >>>>> ________________________________ > >>>>> > >>>>> From: isapros-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > >>>>> [mailto:isapros-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] > >>>>> On Behalf Of Thomas W Shinder > >>>>> Sent: Monday, May 22, 2006 11:00 AM > >>>>> To: isapros@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > >>>>> Subject: [isapros] Re: MSDE Ram Rule of Thumb > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> Hi Steve, > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> There is a way to set a limit on the MSDE process, but I > >>> didn't think > >>>>> there was a requirement to do so. My impression is that > >>> the SBS admins > >>>>> think that MSDE is a runaway process because it does > use available > >>>>> memory, so it looks like it taking too much. But I think > >>> it releases > >>>>> it to other processes that require it. At least that's what I > >>>>> understand at this point. Maybe someone can prove it otherwise. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> Thomas W Shinder, M.D. > >>>>> Site: www.isaserver.org <http://www.isaserver.org/> > >>>>> Blog: http://blogs.isaserver.org/shinder/ > >>>>> Book: http://tinyurl.com/3xqb7 > >>>>> MVP -- ISA Firewalls > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> ________________________________ > >>>>> > >>>>> From: isapros-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > >>>>> [mailto:isapros-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Steve Moffat > >>>>> Sent: Monday, May 22, 2006 8:43 AM > >>>>> To: isapros@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > >>>>> Subject: [isapros] Re: MSDE Ram Rule of Thumb > >>>>> > >>>>> As far as I know, it will release RAM when another app / process > >>>>> requires it. I don't think there is any way to modify > the behavior. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> S > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> ________________________________ > >>>>> > >>>>> From: isapros-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > >>>>> [mailto:isapros-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Amy Babinchak > >>>>> Sent: Sunday, May 21, 2006 8:57 PM > >>>>> To: isapros@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > >>>>> Subject: [isapros] MSDE Ram Rule of Thumb > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> In the SBS world when we switch to MSDE logging in ISA, the MSDE > >>>>> service can end up taking all available ram unless we go > >>> in and tell > >>>>> it otherwise. Is there a rule of thumb for setting the ram > >>> on the MSDE > >>>>> instance for ISA? Something like X requests per minute > = X mb ram? > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> thanks, > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> Amy > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> All mail to and from this domain is GFI-scanned. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> All mail to and from this domain is GFI-scanned. > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >