[ibis-macro] Re: revision of BIRD155.1 - draft 6 uploaded

  • From: "Muranyi, Arpad" <Arpad_Muranyi@xxxxxxxxxx>
  • To: "ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx" <ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Tue, 3 Sep 2013 18:46:29 +0000

Bob,

I don't think that a) for pg. 99-100 forces the parameters
for [External Model] to be in .ami files.  At least that
wasn't the intent.  We can discuss this in the meeting in
about 15 minutes...

Arpad
============================================================

From: ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] 
On Behalf Of Bob Ross
Sent: Tuesday, September 03, 2013 1:39 PM
To: Muranyi, Arpad; ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [ibis-macro] Re: revision of BIRD155.1 - draft 6 uploaded

Arpad:

I object to a) in pg 99 and 109 because it unnecessarily forces
parameters for [External Model] to be in .ami files under that
model for Usage In and Info.  This is unnecessary, does not
apply to [External Circuit] later and is contrary to pending Version 6.0.

Bob

From: ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> 
[mailto:ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Muranyi, Arpad
Sent: Tuesday, September 03, 2013 11:30 AM
To: ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [ibis-macro] Re: revision of BIRD155.1 - draft 6 uploaded

Radek,

I revised the wording (hopefully without changing the meaning)
to be a little more clear on a few aspects.  Please review this:


For (pg. 99 and 100):
=====================

When the extension of the external parameter's file name ends with .ami:

a) the [External Model] parameter may only reference a parameter in an .ami 
file if the [Model] which contains the [External Model] keyword also contains 
an [Algorithmic Model] keyword pointing to the same .ami file

b) if the conditions of clause a) are met, [External Model] parameters may only 
reference parameters of Usage In, Usage Info or Usage Dep parameters in the 
.ami file,

c) if a parameter is of Usage Dep then its value, prior passing it into the 
external model, must be resolved by calling the AMI_Resolve function (see 
Section 10.2.3) of the DLL pointed to by the [Algorithmic Model] keyword.

When the extension of the external parameter's file name does not end with 
".ami":

a) the parameter tree must not contain the Reserved_Parameters branch but must 
contain the Model_Specific branch

b) only Usage Info parameters are allowed in the parameter file


For (pg. 119 and 120):
======================

When the extension of the external parameter's file name ends with .ami:

a) an [External Circuit] parameter may only reference Usage In, Usage Info 
parameters in .ami file,

When the extension of the external parameter's file name does not end with 
".ami":

a) the parameter tree must not contain the Reserved_Parameters branch but must 
contain the Model_Specific branch

b) only Usage Info parameters are allowed in the parameter file



If you agree with this you could copy / paste this into your BIRD.

I am not sure that v6.0 needs to be fixed.  Even though I agree
that it is a little confusing to speak about both keywords in the
discussions of the individual keywords, but the rules are still OK,
simply because we don't have the Dep type and the Resolve function
in the DLL.  But if the group feels that we should fix v6.0 also,
I am not opposed to it...   But isn't it too late for that, now that
the vote is scheduled for 9/20?  The only problem may be that if
we didn't fix the v6.0 spec, we might have a little inconsistency
in the rules between v6.0 and the next version...

Thanks,

Arpad
======================================================================

From: radek_biernacki@xxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:radek_biernacki@xxxxxxxxxxx> 
[mailto:radek_biernacki@xxxxxxxxxxx]
Sent: Tuesday, September 03, 2013 1:24 PM
To: Muranyi, Arpad; ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: RE: revision of BIRD155.1 - draft 6 uploaded

Hi Arpad,

I see, we have four places to correct. I guess the original confusion came from 
the fact that the 6.0 draft referred to both [External Model] and [External 
Circuit] in all of the four places. That should be fixed even for 6.0.

I am fine with your suggestion to allow "generic" reference within [External 
Circuit], and restricting it to the AMI flow within [External Model].

Radek

From: ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> 
[mailto:ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Muranyi, Arpad
Sent: Tuesday, September 03, 2013 11:14 AM
To: ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [ibis-macro] Re: revision of BIRD155.1 - draft 6 uploaded

Radek,

Note that pg. 99 and 100 are under the [External Mode] discussion,
and pg. 119 and 120 are under the [External Circuit] discussion.
I was trying to define two different rules for these two sections
for the case when the parameter comes from an .ami file.  For
{External Circuit] I took your 3rd proposed text which restricts
.ami files to be used only when they belong to an [Algorithmic Model]
keyword, and because of that allow Dep, since we know which DLL belongs
together with this .ami file.

For the [External Circuit] case (pg. 119-120) I still allowed .ami
files, but only Usage In and Info, since we don't know which DLL
belongs to the .ami file that is referenced.

Thanks,

Arpad
==========================================================================

From: ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> 
[mailto:ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of 
radek_biernacki@xxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:radek_biernacki@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Tuesday, September 03, 2013 1:08 PM
To: Muranyi, Arpad; ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [ibis-macro] Re: revision of BIRD155.1 - draft 6 uploaded

Hi Arpad,

That's the difference between the third option vs. the first two. The first two 
allow a reference to ANY .ami file, regardless of the AMI flow, presence of the 
[Algorithmic Model] keyword and for both [External Model] and [External 
Circuit], yet limited to In and Info.

Personally, I am fine with either.

Radek

From: ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> 
[mailto:ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Muranyi, Arpad
Sent: Tuesday, September 03, 2013 11:00 AM
To: ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [ibis-macro] Re: revision of BIRD155.1 - draft 6 uploaded

Yes, I was referring to the third option.
I agree that [External Circuit] still needs to be fixed.
I am working on that.  But I have a question.

Should we just disallow .ami file extensions for [External
Circuit] completely, or should we allow .ami file extensions,
but forbid using the Usage Dep parameters in it?

Thanks,

Arpad
===============================================================

From: ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> 
[mailto:ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of 
radek_biernacki@xxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:radek_biernacki@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Tuesday, September 03, 2013 12:57 PM
To: Muranyi, Arpad; ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [ibis-macro] Re: revision of BIRD155.1 - draft 6 uploaded

Hi Arpad,

I suppose you refer to the third option. Combining a) and b) is fine, yet a 
reference to an .ami within [External Circuit] still needs to be clearly 
disallowed.

Radek

From: ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> 
[mailto:ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Muranyi, Arpad
Sent: Tuesday, September 03, 2013 10:49 AM
To: ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [ibis-macro] Re: revision of BIRD155.1 - draft 6 uploaded

Radek,

I like the second option in red at the end.  However, I think the a) and b)
could be combined.  What do you think about doing this:

a)    an [External Model] parameter may only reference an .ami file if the 
[Model] which contains the [External Model] keyword also contains an 
[Algorithmic Model] keyword pointing to the same .ami file

b)    only Usage In, Usage Info or Usage Dep parameters are allowed,

c)    if a parameter is of Usage Dep then its value, prior passing it into the 
external model, must be resolved by calling the AMI_Resolve function (see 
Section 10.2.3) of the DLL pointed by the [Algorithmic Model] keyword.

Thanks,

Arpad
==========

From: radek_biernacki@xxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:radek_biernacki@xxxxxxxxxxx> 
[mailto:radek_biernacki@xxxxxxxxxxx]
Sent: Tuesday, September 03, 2013 12:32 PM
To: Muranyi, Arpad; ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: RE: revision of BIRD155.1 - draft 6 uploaded

Hi All,

For today's (hopefully final) discussion on BIRD 155 please take look at the 
following three alternatives regarding our discussion on the external 
model/circuit use of the "Dep" parameters.

We propose one of the following three versions to choose from:


a.       no change with respect to the latest draft,

b.      a small addition to the latest draft,


When the extension of the external parameter's file name ends with .ami:

a) in general, only Usage In or Usage Info are allowed for parameters which are 
to be passed into models instantiated by the [External Model] or the [External 
Circuit] keywords,
b) for [External Model] models instantiated from within a [Model] that contains 
the [Algorithmic Model] keyword pointing to the same .ami file, parameters of 
Usage Dep are also allowed to be passed to such models. Before such Usage Dep 
parameters are passed, their values must be resolved by calling the AMI_Resolve 
function (see Section 10.2.3) of the DLL pointed by that [Algorithmic Model] 
keyword.


c.       allowing reference to an .ami file only in the context of AMI (and 
therefore [External Model] only)

When the extension of the external parameter's file name ends with .ami:


a)  a reference to an .ami file is allowed only for parameters which are to be 
passed into models instantiated by the [External Model] keywords from within a 
[Model] that contains the [Algorithmic Model] keyword,

b)  the .ami parameter file pointed by the [Algorithmic Model] keyword must be 
the same as the external file being used for parameter passing,

c)  only Usage In, Usage Info or Usage Dep parameters are allowed,

d)  if a parameter is of Usage Dep then its value, prior passing it into the 
external model, must be resolved by calling the AMI_Resolve function (see 
Section 10.2.3) of the DLL pointed by the [Algorithmic Model] keyword.

Radek

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