[ibis-macro] SPICE in IBIS
- From: "Muranyi, Arpad" <Arpad_Muranyi@xxxxxxxxxx>
- To: "IBIS-ATM" <ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 06:52:47 -0700
Todd,
Isn't your response on the IBIS-users reflector a prime
example for what Bob was talking about in our IBIS-ATM
meeting yesterday (that people will immediately be
unhappy with the limited IBIS-SPICE subset we are
proposing)?
Arpad
========================================================
________________________________
From: owner-ibis-users@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:owner-ibis-users@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx]
On Behalf Of Todd Westerhoff
Sent: Thursday, August 28, 2008 7:37 AM
To: Muniswara Reddy Vorugu
Cc: Prabhat Ranjan; ibis-users@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [IBIS-Users] Dynamic behaviour of buffer
Muniswara,
The other possible solution the obvious one - use a SPICE model for the buffer
- which could be either a transistor model or a behavioral structural model
using controlled sources.
The issue here is one of portability; there are a number of EDA/SI tools that
use SPICE (or HSPICE) as their simulation engine, and could therefore make use
of such a model. VHDL-AMS is certainly capable of modeling this behavior,
but there are far fewer tools that would be able to run the model. If you're a
semiconductor vendor producing a model for end-users, that's usually a
consideration - you want a model that will run in as many tools as possible.
Wouldn't it be nice if we could run SPICE models as easily as we use IBIS
models? It's really not that hard. You simply need a traditional IBIS buffer
model that also points to a corresponding SPICE model. The traditional IBIS
buffer model only represents a single case of output loading, as you pointed
out. The SPICE model works in any loading condition. If a particular EDA tool
can't use the SPICE model directly, it still has a conventional IBIS buffer
model based on the specific loading condition. If the EDA tool is able to use
the SPICE model, then the user gets both the increased precision of the SPICE
model and the benefit of the IBIS use model (graphically place the device in
the schematic, connect it up, and simulate).
The use of the SPICE model is transparent to the user, who gets the benefit of
SPICE modeling without any changes to the way they run their simulations.
I'm sure you've already guessed - but that's exactly how our software works,
and also _why_ it works that way. We think combining the IBIS use model with
the enhanced precision of SPICE models makes good practical sense.
Todd.
Todd Westerhoff
VP, Software Products
SiSoft
6 Clock Tower Place, Suite 250
Maynard, MA 01754
(978) 461-0449 x24
twesterh@xxxxxxxxxx
www.sisoft.com
Muniswara Reddy Vorugu wrote:
Hi Prabhat,
I have also, faced the same problem, while modeling Low-speed mode of
USB1.1.
Tried many options of R_fixture and C_fixture, but did not find any
improvement.
It looks like, we should be very lucky to get proper matching using the
VT tables.
To understand the cause of the inability of VT table methodology, look
at
slide4-5 of the following presentation.
http://www.vhdl.org/pub/ibis/summits/jun03b/muranyi1.pdf
It looks like; AMS-VHDL is the only solution.
The above presentation contains the concept of AMS-VHDL also.
Hope this helps you.
Regards,
Muniswar
________________________________
From: owner-ibis-users@xxxxxxx [mailto:owner-ibis-users@xxxxxxx] On
Behalf Of Prabhat Ranjan
Sent: Thursday, August 28, 2008 12:59 AM
To: ibis-users@xxxxxxx
Subject: [IBIS-Users] Dynamic behaviour of buffer
Hello Experts,
I have a driver with Slope control circuit at output pin. This circuit
controls driver behaviour according to the Load on output pin.
IBIS model of this buffer has only R_fixture but when I am simulating
IBIS model with certain capacitive load then IBIS is not able to produce exact
SPICE behaviour.
My observation for mismatch is dynamic behavior of Slope control
circuit with load which I am not able to model in IBIS.
My question is how can I model the dynamic behaviour of Slope control
circuit in IBIS ?
Regards
Prabhat
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