Walter, I re-read the two documents you distributed with your email. While I agree that the specification could use a major overhaul, your documents may be considered only a starting point at best, as they do not answer most of the questions we are trying to answer in this email discussion thread, and in addition, your documents raise more questions which would have to be dealt with in detail (a time consuming process, as you know it very well). For example, the "Section_AMI_DLL_Interface" document talks about a "time domain waveform" under 3.2.2.1, and it seems that this waveform, although not defined, is an analog waveform. In BIRD 120 we have already established that the input to GetWave should be a "digital" waveform: | Step 4. The simulation platform produces a digital stimulus waveform. A | digital stimulus waveform is 0.5 when the stimulus is "high", | -0.5 when the stimulus is "low", and may have a value between | -0.5 and 0.5 such that transitions occur when the stimulus | crosses 0. Are you proposing to change that back to an analog waveform again? Also, we have already approved BIRD 112 on Clock Times, so 3.2.2.3 in your document would also have to be replaced by BIRD 112. Although 3.1.2.6 contains a lot of detail about the parameter string, it doesn't answer the questions about how the In, Out, and InOut parameters are given to or returned by the DLL (which is one of the main things this thread is dealing with). Since we have already completed several of the "correction" and "clarification" BIRDs and our Typos BIRD is also fairly close to being done, I would suggest to finish our task of making the corrections to the AMI specification first and talk about new features and rewriting the entire AMI section at a later time. Thanks, Arpad ================================================================== From: Walter Katz [mailto:wkatz@xxxxxxxxxx] Sent: Tuesday, December 07, 2010 9:17 AM To: radek_biernacki@xxxxxxxxxxx; Muranyi, Arpad; ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: RE: [ibis-macro] Re: About the Typos BIRD comments from Fangyi All, I suggest you all re-read the introduction to AMI modeling and DLL interface sections of what I had submitted to the group in March. I believed then and continue to believe that the whole AMI section needed to be rewritten with a proper introduction, and a coherent flow. Walter From: ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of radek_biernacki@xxxxxxxxxxx Sent: Monday, December 06, 2010 8:57 PM To: Arpad_Muranyi@xxxxxxxxxx; ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [ibis-macro] Re: About the Typos BIRD comments from Fangyi Hi Arpad, Sorry for a delayed reply. I would suggest expanding the text to cover the following issues: (a) description of how the "Reserved Parameters" and "Model Specific" names are to be not included: if a name is not included does it mean that the corresponding pair of parentheses is also removed (I think so - but we need to say so). Perhaps we could define it as "branch collapsing"), (b) the opening sentence seems to cover both the "_in" and the "_out" strings, yet in Item 3 the parameters of Usage Out are excluded; perhaps we can cover each case separately, (c) we need to say whether all "In" and "InOut" parameters in the case of the "_in" string, and all "InOut" and "Out" in the case of the "_out" string shall be included, and whether the order shall be consistent with the AMI file, (d) we need to say whether the DLL shall gracefully ignore any other parameter whose name may or may even not be in the AMI file (if so, we do not need to say that parameters other than (c) need to be omitted, (e) for Item 4 we need to define the process of making branches to become leaves, (f) we need to precisely define Value (and Default) for parameters whose format requires more than one number to constitute a value, or we may coin another terms such as "composite value". Radek From: ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Muranyi, Arpad Sent: Friday, December 03, 2010 8:32 AM To: ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [ibis-macro] Re: About the Typos BIRD comments from Fangyi Hello AMI Experts, This thread stopped a day or so ago without reaching a conclusion. I am going to summarize the questions I would like to get answered. 1) When does a branch become an "AMI parameter"? Does this have to be spelled out in the IBIS-ATM specification, or does this belong to a Cookbook or HOWTO document? Currently this is what I have in the Typos BIRD draft: |* A branch in the .ami file is an "AMI Parameter" if it |* contains the leaves Type, Usage, and any of the following |* leaves: |* |* Default |* <data_format> or Format <data_format> |* |* and does not contain another branch. A branch which |* contains one or more sub-branches may only contain the |* Description <string> leaf/value pair in addition to the |* sub-branches. 2) What is supposed to be passed into the AMI executable model in the parameter string, and what is supposed to be omitted from this string? Does this have to be spelled out in the IBIS-ATM specification, or does this belong to a Cookbook or HOWTO document? Currently this is what I have in the Typos BIRD draft: ************************************************************************ ******** REMOVE THIS PARAGRAPH if the next few are agreed on:**************************** |* The tree data structure passed in and out of the DLL |* described in section 3.1.2.6 of Section 10 of this document |* is similar to the tree data structure in the .ami file except |* the 'Reserved_Parameters' and 'Model_Specific' branch names are |* not included, the "AMI Parameter" branches become leaves and |* the "AMI parameters" of Usage Info and Out are not included. END OF REMOVED PARAGRAPH******************************************************** ************************************************************************ ******** |* |* The parameter string passed in and out of the DLL (described in |* section 3.1.2.6 of Section 10 of this document) is formatted |* the same way as the tree data structure in the .ami file with |* the following exceptions: |* |* 1) The "Reserved_Parameters" and "Model_Specific" branch |* names are not included |* 2) None of the Description leaf/value pairs are included |* 3) AMI Parameter branches or sub branches with Usage Info |* or Usage Out are omitted, but all other branches or sub |* branches are included |* 4) AMI Parameter branches with Usage In or Usage InOut |* become leaves |* 3) Define how/where the DLL returns Out or InOut parameters and how/where the EDA tool is supposed to look for these values. Does this have to be spelled out in the IBIS-ATM specification, or does this belong to a Cookbook or HOWTO document? There is nothing on this topic in the Typos BIRD draft, nor can I find anything about this in the current IBIS specification. Thanks, Arpad ======================================================================== ======