I missed one point in the fatal flaw statement. The whole reason I got into BeOS, and Haiku was entirely the fact that it WASN'T linux or BSD! It worked with no pain. Everything just worked, no mess no fuss. Perhaps over the last 10 years that effect has been lost but the Linux's and BSDs still have a long long long way to go to creating a clean slick user targeted desktop OS. Before anyone argues, just let the numbers talk. And yes I am a daily linux desktop victim. unwilling perhaps, but daily victim... Euan