[haiku-inc] Re: RFC: additions to Trademark policy

  • From: "Jorge G. Mare" <koki@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • To: haiku-inc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
  • Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2010 15:16:36 -0700

Hi Ryan,

Ryan Leavengood wrote:
On Mon, Apr 26, 2010 at 2:23 PM, Jorge G. Mare <koki@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
I don't recall the exact time and I don't the have email archives anymore,
nor do I have access to them online (naturally).

So in other words you can't really prove your assertion that your
email was completely ignored. Assuming we are speaking of the same
email it seems you were simply exaggerating to try to make your point.

As I said, I don't have the emails anymore, so I am afraid I can't prove you anything. Feel free to think as you please; I can't blame you for that. You can't deny, though, that there is a pattern where I offer help, and that offer is ignored. Such was the case with my recent offer to draft HUG guidelines (ignored). Or the very specific observations of the many contradictions the the RFC has (ignored). Or my offer to rectify the latest financial (2008) report, where you told me (and I quote)...

Ryan Leavengood said:
Well someone has to do it. Also I welcome suggestions for improvements
to these reports, but much like the code in our projects, a "patch"
speaks much louder than just suggestions.

...to which I responded:

Jorge G. Mare aka Koki said:
As mentioned several times in the past, I would be glad to help with the Haiku Inc. reports. Email me whatever file you have created this in, and I will take a shot at it.

I never received a response from you or anyone else.

This is not the kind of thing that can be merged, plus I don't even know
where that document is now.

Well I'm not sure that it is true that such documents cannot be
merged. I would think various aspects of each which complement or
strengthen each other could be put together. But maybe not.

In the email I referenced you provided a link to a document here:

http://testwebsite.haiku-os.org/node/2077

Obviously that link no longer works (and node 2077 on the Haiku site
is now a VMware article), but maybe the content remains in Drupal
somewhere, or in a backup.

That ULR belonged to an old test website that we used to experiment with Drupal; I doubt there is a backup, but I would not know. Anyway, even if you could recover the data, you would not be able to merge it with what Matt wrote the way you think. Sure, you may be able to get ideas, but certainly not merge them, as my articulation was very different from that of Matt.

And to be honest, at this point I am not in the mood of renewing my offer
anymore, because it is a waste of time.

I was just making the point about the fallacy of Haiku Inc.'s constant
argument that things are done deficiently because nobody else volunteers,
when that is not in fact the truth.

Well if you are the only one who volunteers to help, and then you
leave in a huff when things don't go exactly your way without any
arguments, then I don't think it is a valid example.

I am not leaving in a huff; It is just very clear that my contributions are welcome. Anything Matt or other people say to the contrary is simply hypocrite lip service.

I base this conclusion on the fact that, in this thread alone, all I get is "you have to accept what's decided or leave" attitude from one of the most prominent developers and one of the BOD members in spite of having taken the time to prodiving input for the RFC (which is a joke, btw).

Together with the precedents that I already pointed out of offers for help going ignored, I can only conclude that, contrary to what some hypocrites may say on the record, they don't want me to be involved in these matters (and probably in any other matters either).

If other people feel that efforts to volunteer and help out with
Haiku, Inc. related issues have gone ignored, please speak up.

Hello! This is what I am doing!

I won't make any firm statements that Haiku, Inc. and those who run it
have not made mistakes. But I think it is obvious to most people
reading this that you, Jorge, have a chip on your shoulder regarding
Haiku, Inc., and because of that it is apparently impossible for us to
meet your standards. Any rational discussion of something related to
Haiku, Inc. almost always seems to devolve into you claiming a grand
conspiracy, with all of Haiku, Inc. (and maybe even the project
itself) against you.

I don't judge people for who they are, but for what they do. It is very easy to not look at the facts and resort to the Jorge has a grudge with Haiku Inc. theory. The truth is that if you took the time to read this thread, you should see that I pointed out a lot of obvious deficiencies and contradictions in the RFC here:

//www.freelists.org/post/haiku-inc/RFC-additions-to-Trademark-policy,2

Has there been any response to that? No. Most responses to what I say revolved around the same authoritarian posture that Matt (and now Ingo) want to impose. Matt even goes to the extent of making the point that he will draft another version "something along the line's of Jonas's suggestions", but makes no mention whatsoever to any of my input. Has he refuted any of the issues that I pointed out? No, of course not. Because it is not about having an intelligent exchange of the issues to reach a well informed decision; for him it is always about flashing his BOD badge, making decisions contrary to what he considers his enemies and as a last resort using forceful or intimidating language to silence people who hold a different view.

I try to see your point of view and be your advocate if possible, but
when you make unfair and untrue accusations (like emails being
completely ignored when they were not) it becomes harder for me to do
so.

But anyhow, I'm continuing this off-topic discussion, so I will stop now.

Let's try to be productive and draft a reasonable trademark policy
instead of delving into project politics.

I have tried, but I am tired of wasting my time with either ill-intentioned and/or ignorant people that don't want to listen. So good luck with making this shitty RFC that could have only been written by someone who does not have a clue into something that is actually useful for the project.

Regards,

--
Jorge/aka Koki
Website: http://haikuzone.net
RSS: http://haikuzone.net/rss.xml



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