On Mon, 01 Sep 2008 22:08:39 +0200, Jorge Mare <kokitomare@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
On Sun, Aug 31, 2008 at 12:43 AM, André Braga <meianoite@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:On Sun, Aug 31, 2008 at 00:00, Urias McCullough <umccullough@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:I apologize that I didn't read the whole novel ;)Doh :)- but I wanted to clarify something that I believe needs to be clarified here (I thinkit's a common misconception).Actually, there was no misconception on my part; you've just hit the nail in the head when you said:That doesn't mean Haiku, Inc. is useless of course, and it can grow to provide even more for the project in the future I think.There! *That's* what I meant. That we could use Haiku, Inc to help separate the roles of development and decision-making *in a public relations standpoint*, even though the people behind those roles are likely to be the same. And that this is not something for the future; we should do it *now*. In other words: code-wise, I feel that we're in great hands, no questions about it; it's just that people-wise we're both wasting the developers talent forcing them to deal with politics when they don't want to, and wasting non-developers talent not providing them the proper means, structure and communication channels, to help the project the way they're able, and want, to. And that Haiku, Inc could be a good tool to provide this structure. Are we lacking volunteers to make this happen? This is not me complaining or demanding anything while not having the marbles to put my money where my mouth is. Actually, I don't know if I have what it takes to deal with those things, but I always wanted to dedicate more of my time to the project as soon as I sort ou the mess that is my life :)I tend to agree with Urias that there may be a lot of misconceptions about what Haiku Inc. is and is not, so let me try to put it into perspective. Haiku Inc. is NOT to the Haiku project what the Gnome Foundation is to Gnome or KDE e.V. to the KDE Project. The main reason for this is that the Haiku devs choose not be involved in the non-profit (I don't blame them) and have put almost every *key* aspect of Haiku under their own control (I don't blame them for this either). This reduces Haiku Inc. to a very limited role that has no influence in the vision and/or future direction of the project. IMO, the resulting irrelevance of Haiku Inc. at the higher level of the project leadership makes it very unattractive to be involved in the non-profit, as it mostly means boring paperwork and legal responsibilities. Also because Haiku Inc. is not part of the group that sets direction or provides a vision for the project as a whole, even those areas where it can contribute (say, funding), it kind of operates in a vacuum and disconnected from the key decision-makers, making it all more disjointed and thus difficult to use the non-profit as an effective tool. I think this is the way it is because the admins/devs were used to (and most probably still prefer) the arrangement that they had with Michael Phipps (implied or by design), where he ran the non-profit all alone and provided the link between Haiku Inc. and the leadership. But since Michael left the project, this arrangement cannot obviously work. The transition was supposed to address this by engaging more people, including some at the project leadership level so that Haiku Inc. could become part of that leadership. It turns out, though, that we have struggled in the sense that most of the weight fell onto one or two individuals, and the idea of a synergistic approach with the project leaders to elevate the profile of Haiku Inc. has not worked either. At this point I am out of ideas, and very low on energy and motivation. Recently Urias M. has offered to step up and become part of Haiku Inc. in an attempt to move it forward. I know Urias well and have done quite a bit of Haiku-related stuff with him together (most notable the recent LinuxWorld); I think we make a good team, and I could cooperate. But personally I remain skeptical as to whether it is worth for me to make the effort if Haiku Inc. is going to remain in isolation from the project leadership and irrelevant as it relates to the direction and/or vision of the project. I don't see that happening without the Haiku devs becoming involved, and knowing that this is very unlikely to ocurr, I see no way out. Sorry for the negative tone of this message, but I just felt the urge to let people know the way things are, at least the way I see them. Of course, others that are/were involved in the transition team may have a different view and/or opinion, and they are welcome to give their views if they so wish. Jorge
Thank you Koki for this words.But i am Member from www.befan.org. We are a Germany Hostet Foundation/Club ( Verein), also
a liitel bit as we KDE.e.V.BeFan.e.V works in time to the new strukture, any infos cames out by the last BeGeistert. I cant tell in details, but when we finsih the new strukture then can we tell.
Some point is: - a e.V is democratic , this mean the member can vote (he have a voice) - e.V can get and put money and can to guaranty this ( e.V used a Law )- e.V membership is International, its not needed to live in Germany (see KDE. e.V)
- ... By any question feel free an mail to info@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxPS. Haiku.inc you need Helps ore you need a background base , we can help ;-)
-- Ralf Schülke aka stargater
