A nice piece of research Phil. So all those MS's are handicapping themselves greatly in restricting science to just materialism. What really angers me is that the rest of us are forced, by their bullying through teaching organisations, to accept this limitation or be ostracised - hence the need for a film like 'Expelled, No intelligence Needed'. Jack ----- Original Message ----- From: philip madsen To: geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2008 12:32 AM Subject: [geocentrism] Re: RELIGION IN SCIENCE. I have much to support my case already presented I was unaware of at the time. Yet this is my pick as it is conclusive on the matter of science being a small limited part of philosophy.. In fact it hardle get a mention in the [edit] Branches of philosophy To give an exhaustive list of the main divisions of philosophy is difficult because various topics have been studied by philosophers at various times. Ethics, metaphysics, epistemology, and logic are usually included. Other topics include politics, aesthetics, and religion. In addition, most academic subjects have a philosophy, for example the philosophy of science, the philosophy of mathematics, and the philosophy of history. Metaphysics was first studied systematically by Aristotle. He did not use that term; the term emerged because in later editions of Aristotle's works the book on what is now called metaphysics came after Aristotle's study of physics. He calls the subject "first philosophy" (or sometimes just "wisdom"), and says it is the subject that deals with "first causes and the principles of things".[8] The modern meaning of the term is any inquiry dealing with the ultimate nature of what exists. "What's out there?" is a common way of summarizing the nature of metaphysical questions. Epistemology is concerned with the nature and scope of knowledge, and whether knowledge is possible. "How do you know?" is the canonical epistemic question. Ethics, or 'moral philosophy', is concerned with questions of how agents ought to act. Plato's early dialogues constitute a search for definitions of virtue. Metaethics is the study of whether ethical value judgments can be objective at all. Ethics can also be conducted within a religious context. If the other two branches so far ask "What is out there?" and "How do you know?", then Ethics asks "What should we do about it?" Ethics questions are either concerned directly with actions (normative ethics), or concerned with Good and Evil in general (metaethics). Logic has two broad divisions: mathematical logic (formerly symbolic logic) and philosophy of logic NOW Science As such, the scientific method cannot deduce anything about the realm of reality that is beyond what is observable by existing or theoretical means.[14] When a manifestation of our reality previously considered supernatural is understood in the terms of causes and consequences, it acquires a scientific explanation.[15] Philosophy is the discipline concerned with questions of how one should live (ethics); what sorts of things exist (metaphysics); the nature of knowledge (epistemology); and the principles of reasoning (logic).[1][2] The word is of Ancient Greek origin: φιλοσοφία (philosophía), meaning "love of knowledge", "love of wisdom".[3][4][5] This is an excellent article covering most of what I wanted to say... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosophy and from Science . http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Science Science (from the Latin scientia, meaning "knowledge") is the effort to understand, or to understand better, how the physical world works, with observable evidence as the basis of that understanding. It is done through observation of phenomena, and/or through experimentation that tries to simulate events under controlled conditions. and the philosophy of science, I chose this, The philosophy of science seeks to understand the nature and justification of scientific knowledge. It has proven difficult to provide a definitive account of the scientific method that can decisively serve to distinguish science from non-science. Thus there are legitimate arguments about exactly where the borders are, leading to the problem of demarcation. There is nonetheless a set of core precepts that have broad consensus among published philosophers of science and within the scientific community at large. Science is reasoned-based analysis of sensation upon our awareness. As such, the scientific method cannot deduce anything about the realm of reality that is beyond what is observable by existing or theoretical means.[14] When a manifestation of our reality previously considered supernatural is understood in the terms of causes and consequences, it acquires a scientific explanation.[15] Philip.