[geocentrism] Re: Psalm 19/ Christ 2nd Return

  • From: "philip madsen" <pma15027@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • To: <geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2008 17:37:30 +1000

Allen this came through normal
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: allendaves@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx 
  To: geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
  Sent: Saturday, August 23, 2008 1:02 PM
  Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Psalm 19/ Christ 2nd Return


        ok..I may have to try sending everything as attachments. If you guys 
are interested...it would be helpfull if you download efax veiwer it it the 
only format that allows 11mb files to be compressed to 189Kb while keeping all 
of the formating and text select and color properties of a document...I have 
used this program for about 10 years now...it is a great free program!
        .it is a very reliable program from a reliable source the viewer is 
free...even many companies use it for sharing digital documents....it is not 
spy ware or anything like that take a look 
        http://www.efax.com/en/efax/twa/page/download
        it will greatly facilitae large files with high quality graphics &  
keep the quality and all the properties while keeping file sizes down to a 
minium......that way all that stuff i have already sent you would have fit on 
one attachment only about 180kb instead of 2megs of web pages that i have sent 
thus far....and you would not have to scroll and you could print out this stuff 
without having to reset  margines or having MS excell to open with....let me 
know

        --- On Fri, 8/22/08, marc-veilleux@xxxxxxxxxxxx 
<marc-veilleux@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

        From: marc-veilleux@xxxxxxxxxxxx <marc-veilleux@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
        Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Psalm 19/ Christ 2nd Return
        To: "Geocentric" <geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
        Date: Friday, August 22, 2008, 6:54 PM



         
        Allen, I still have to scroll sideways your emails.  My server (I 
assume this is what you call mail client) is sympatico.
        Marc V.
         

        ----- Original Message -----
        From: allendaves@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
        Sent: 21 août 2008 22:40
        To: geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
        Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Psalm 19/ Christ 2nd Return
         



        Let me know if the one i just posted did the same 
thing.........Bernnie, Nevile, Pete is this happining to you guys as 
well?....is it all the text or what?......it works fine on mine im just using 
yahoo mail nothing special .......no fancy formating,  i only do any of that in 
the ziped web pages.....what mail client are you guys using?

        --- On Thu, 8/21/08, marc-veilleux@xxxxxxxxxxxx 
<marc-veilleux@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

        From: marc-veilleux@xxxxxxxxxxxx <marc-veilleux@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
        Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Psalm 19/ Christ 2nd Return
        To: "Geocentric" <geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
        Date: Thursday, August 21, 2008, 7:08 PM



        Allen,
        I also have to scroll sideways your email; this is not practical.
        Marc V.
         

        ----- Original Message -----
        From: allendaves@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
        Sent: 21 août 2008 17:35
        To: geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
        Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Psalm 19/ Christ 2nd Return
         




        I have another post to make here latter this evening  but let see if we 
can get this fixed...i dont know why it would be doing that mine comes out ok 
...how about anyone else?

        --- On Thu, 8/21/08, philip madsen <pma15027@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

        From: philip madsen <pma15027@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
        Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Psalm 19/ Christ 2nd Return
        To: geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
        Date: Thursday, August 21, 2008, 2:08 PM



        Allen I canna read your mail, scrolling sideways,  the lines stretch 
all the way to my neighbours house.
        Philip.  

        ----- Original Message ----- 
        From: allendaves@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx 
        To: geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
        Sent: Friday, August 22, 2008 1:34 AM
        Subject: [geocentrism] Psalm 19/ Christ 2nd Return











        Peter, 
        Part A.
         What you are addressing is a problem for the idea of Christ return as 
some future event not the past?!  What you miss is that scripture and Jesus do 
not define the "end of the world as you currently know it" judgment and the 
resurection to all take pace at the same time at Christ return. ..."then cometh 
the end when"...."for he must riegn untill he has put all enimies under His 
feet"...."the last enemy is death"......Here is the punch line......We know 
from revelation ch 20 that Christ Reighn last no less than 1000 years!!! there 
are folks alive on the earth for at least 1000 years after Christ 
return!!!!!!!!!!!!!.....In fact, the futurist nonsense misses the fact that 
there are 2 resurections of the dead not one!. Only the Godly take part in the 
first Resurection and only the wicked take part in the second...On top of that 
there is atleast but not limited to a 1000 years between the start of thoes two 
different Resurections!!.....
         
        the sequence is 1.Christ returns first 2. then the frist resurection ( 
judment begins with the ouse of God.... they live and reign)  that last at 
least 1000 years...in fact there are people still alive on the earth after that 
1000 years...which is a 1000 years after Christ returns 3. the "rest of the 
dead" who are not Godly they are the follks left ...they are judged...by christ 
and the saints they are cast into the lake of fire 4. then death and hell are 
cast into the lake of fire.............the futurist miss the whole sequence as 
well as the time line for Christ 2nd comming  Period!........No, what you 
address is not a problem for Christ return in the first century, However, to 
argue that Christ did not come in the first century poses multiple terminal 
problems for those who say he has not returned but will supposedly come at 
sometime in the future!!!
         

         
         
        Part B.
        As for the term "generation": you missed it on two counts.....
         
        1. The L&P outline a date..ref the disscussion on 666 from the street 
and the wall Dan 70 weks vison ..this will yeild the date of AD 70 and it is 
the only date you can arive at using the numbers in the text consistently. This 
proof ( a mathematical certainty) is indipendent of the next point...... see 
attached and explination below..
        2. Christ specificaly identifies folks who would not see physical death 
untill he came back...unless of course you argue that Christ 2nd reterun with 
His holy angels and gathering his saints takes place on multiple 
occasions??....multiple 2nd commings??.....ummmm.. No Jesus ment it exactly the 
way He said it the problem is folks dont belive HIM...
        These two points are independent of each other. The problem is for 
those who say Jesus and the L&P did not know what they were talking about 
because they do not understand scripture.
         
         
          
         The Attached charts I sent you demonstrate and even prove:
         
        1. The Persian kings (found in the text) chronology only works one way 
and most donʼt get it. The AD/BC date line is not only correct ( Denise the 
little was right, his critics donʼt have a clue!) No other construct would be 
consistent with the text itself ..This fact is mathematically demonstrated 
independent of how anyone feels about Astronomy, Daniel, Eschatology or 
anything else for that matter. It covers all possibilities, shows only one 
consistent within the times listed in the text itself independent but especialy 
if you take broad but generaly accepted historical facts into consideration. 
         
        2 The middle of the week in Daniel 9 was accomplished in AD 70 (still 
half a week left "unto the consummation") Ad 70 was not the end of 
everything!..it was only the middle of Daniel's last week. The last week is 7 
years. The gentiles trampled the city for the remainder 3 1/2 years of 1260 
days..."even unto the consummation"... "your redemption draweth nigh"....This 
the whole point to:..Time( 70weeks) Times(62&7weeks); and half a time (1 week) 
the confirmation was for the whole week but in the middle of that week was the 
end to sacrifice and offering...."unto the consumation
         

        3. 666 refers to the only man that was also a beast found in the 
biblical text let him who has wisdom count 666 years.......This is the number 
of years the heathen are allowed to rule "in the land" of God. AD 70 the 
physical kingdom is destroyed in favor of a completely Spiritual kingdom with 
no flesh and blood in it to corrupt it. Flesh and blood cannot enter into the 
kingdom of heaven. 
         
        4. The redemption work "Put an end to sin"; "make reconciliation for 
iniquity"(Dan 9 & Luke 21 et al) of God was not accomplished until after the 
physical temple was destroyed. Christ could not enter into the holy of holies 
while the first physical temple was standing. The physical temple was destroyed 
in AD 70 only then could our high priest (after the order of Melchisedec not 
Arron!) enter and finishing the reconciliation and receptive work done on the 
cross....Even most preterist, particularly reformed theological ones donʼt get 
it!!!
         
        Hebrews 9:1.  Then verily the first covenant had also ordinances of 
divine service, and a worldly sanctuary. 2.  For there was a tabernacle made; 
the first, wherein was the candlestick, and the table, and the shewbread; which 
is called the sanctuary. 3.  And after the second veil, the tabernacle which is 
called the Holiest of all; 4.  Which had the golden censer, and the ark of the 
covenant overlaid round about with gold, wherein was the golden pot that had 
manna, and Aaron's rod that budded, and the tables of the covenant; 5.  And 
over it the cherubims of glory shadowing the mercyseat; of which we cannot now 
speak particularly. 6.  Now when these things were thus ordained, the priests 
went always into the first tabernacle, accomplishing the service of God. 7.  
But into the second went the high priest alone once every year, not without 
blood, which he offered for himself, and for the errors of the people: 8.  The 
Holy Ghost this signifying, that the way into the holiest of all was not yet 
made manifest, while as the first tabernacle was yet standing: 9.  Which was a 
figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and 
sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining 
to the conscience; 10.  Which stood only in meats and drinks, and divers 
washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation. 
11.  But Christ being come an high priest of good things to come, by a greater 
and more perfect tabernacle, not made with hands, that is to say, not of this 
building; 12.  Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood 
he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for 
us. 13.  For if the blood of bulls and of goats, and the ashes of an heifer 
sprinkling the unclean, sanctifieth to the purifying of the flesh: 14.  How 
much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered 
himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the 
living God? 15.  And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, 
that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were 
under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of 
eternal inheritance. 16.  For where a testament is, there must also of 
necessity be the death of the testator. 17.  For a testament is of force after 
men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth. 
18.  Whereupon neither the first testament was dedicated without blood. 19  For 
when Moses had spoken every precept to all the people according to the law, he 
took the blood of calves and of goats, with water, and scarlet wool, and 
hyssop, and sprinkled both the book, and all the people, 20.  Saying, This is 
the blood of the testament which God hath enjoined unto you. 21.  Moreover he 
sprinkled with blood both the tabernacle, and all the vessels of the ministry. 
22.  And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without 
shedding of blood is no remission. 23.  It was therefore necessary that the 
patterns of things in the heavens should be purified with these; but the 
heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these. 24.  For Christ 
is not entered into the holy places made with hands, which are the figures of 
the true; but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for 
us:25.  Nor yet that he should offer himself often, as the high priest entereth 
into the holy place every year with blood of others; 26.  For then must he 
often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once in the end 
of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself. 27.  
And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment: 28.  
So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look 
for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.
         
          
        Chirst appears without sin the second time because here in Ch 9 it just 
told you that it is only after Christ goes itno the holy of holies (only after 
the physical temple was destroyed) that the redemption for the sins under the 
first covenant could be fully accomplished at that time when He would come 
again.
         
        If christ did not Come when he said He would in that generation in 
their life time ...then there is no hope of anything!
         

        --- On Thu, 8/21/08, PETER CHARLTON <peter.nambo@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

        From: PETER CHARLTON <peter.nambo@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
        Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Psalm 19
        To: geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
        Date: Thursday, August 21, 2008, 3:31 AM





        Trouble with this view of Christs return in 70 ad, is that some rather 
remarkable things happen after his 1000 year rule has ended, things such as 
death and hell being thrown in the lake of fire, well we still have death dont 
we?, I also do not see the tent of God being with mankind at present, etc etc, 
in fact it looks very much to me as if the Devil is still running the world.
         
        When Jesus talked about a "generation," he had just been talking about 
the sign of his prescence, and said the generation that saw these signs, would 
still be alive to see his second coming, not the generation that saw his first 
coming.
         
        Pete Charlton     

        ----- Original Message ----- 
        From: Bernie Brauer 
        To: geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
        Sent: Wednesday, August 20, 2008 7:14 PM
        Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Psalm 19



        Allen,
         
        Kevin Craig has this:
        http://members.aol.com/VFTprayer/heaven/antichrist.htm
         
        Bernie


        2008/8/20 <allendaves@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>







        With respect to your last two post, the general thrust being we should 
take scripture literally. However, as you well know different people even the 
ones who hold that view only carry it in so far as their philosophies or 
doctrine allow. In the same way that some folks look at that verse and say 
see.. the sun moves..I look at Jesus remarks and say...see Jesus' 2nd coming 
took place just as he described in that generation, in the lifetime of those he 
talked with. In fact If Jesus did not come then what in the world is peoples 
faith in why are they Christian at all. If Christ did not do what he said he 
would do almost 2000 years ago what in the world makes folks think Christ will 
one day do it?! If His comments were not the literal truth of the matter, then 
how do you know how to "interpret the truth" that without first knowing what 
the truth is?! This is the same kind of questions the atheist and agnostics 
pose to those who do not take scripture at face value when it plainly states 
the sun moves and the earth. Folks missed Christ first coming looking for a 
physical king..they missed his second coming because......They are looking for 
a physical king...imagine that!....even after He specifically spoke to that 
effect otherwise.....What in the world are people looking for?!..Many are going 
to wake up one day and realize, after it is too late, God meant what he said 
and said exactly what he meant...."interpretations" were worthless.....the sun 
not the earth moves...and Christ did come exactly when he said he would to 
judge the world and that is what is taking place now.......they are being slain 
by the word of his mouth, when the first resurrection is complete then they too 
will be resurrected but with a much different fate, ....damnation ....because 
they "received not the love of the truth" nor did they " love His appearing" 
.......
         
         
        --- On Wed, 8/20/08, Bernie Brauer <bbrauer777@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

        From: Bernie Brauer <bbrauer777@xxxxxxxxx>
        Subject: [geocentrism] Psalm 19
        To: "Geocentrism/RealityReviewed" <geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
        Date: Wednesday, August 20, 2008, 8:37 AM 










        "Psalm 19 gives us an awesome look at the transforming power of God and 
his word. Verses 1-6 declare the glory of God's creation and the fact the 
heavens and skies are enduring evidence of God's existence and creative power."
         1The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament sheweth his 
handywork. 
         2Day unto day uttereth speech, and night unto night sheweth knowledge. 
         3There is no speech nor language, where their voice is not heard. 
         4Their line is gone out through all the earth, and their words to the 
end of the world. In them hath he set a tabernacle for the sun, 
         5Which is as a bridegroom coming out of his chamber, and rejoiceth as 
a strong man to run a race. 
         6His going forth is from the end of the heaven, and his circuit unto 
the ends of it: and there is nothing hid from the heat thereof." 

Other related posts: