If so then they all would be seen to do 190million mile 24 hour circles of their own virtually around nothing.. Why consider the Sun nothing? Planets move as the firmament compels them. Leave the firmament out of it and lets stick to gravity of the sort that causes the moon to orbit Earth. Check your figures.. the planets orbit the sun over many months, but the sun does a 24 hour 190 million mile diameter circle.. Looking at that, as the planet mars is doing its annual monthly walk around space, its sun moves in this almighty big circle. EVERY 24 HOURS.. From where I sit, if mars is attached to the sun by gravity, then this cord is getting an awful big stretch every day. or as I said, if it keeps the same distance it must then do a 24 hour wobble of its own. a 190million mile wobble. Now even if we consider the firmament as a solid separate unit, which circles the earth, and have Mars imbedded in it as an orbiter of the sun keeping its specific distance, then we would have to see mars orbiting earth every day, coming closer and further anywhere up to 190 million miles variation over a year, doing this specifically every 24 hours.. I sat down and moved the models paper wise.. We know 2 instances of the Sun's motion being interrupted: Joshua's long day and Fatima.. The planetary motions were not affected in either case, sooooooooooo Doesn't that mean that the Sun does not control the planets, but something else does?? No it doesn't I still believe God allows natural law to govern. And you cannot compare Fatima with Josh. In the latter case the sun world wide stopped, God said so, it was not a prodigy, (supernatural event, with local environmental appearances ) such as with Fatima. where we know the real sun shone normally and did nothing untoward. Philip. ----- Original Message ----- From: Robert Bennett To: geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Sent: Sunday, July 29, 2007 5:11 AM Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Moving Earth Deception Was this tongue-in-cheek? I see no smilies. Sounds complicated to me. And rather difficult to accept.. You are saying the sun is powerful enough to hold all the solar system planets (except earth) by gravity to itself, as orbiting planets, and yet then the earth is tied rigidly to what? MS - not I - says solar gravity holds the system together. I say the CBs all move according to the place they were first set in the moving firmament. There's no firmament in the Earth (or WAF) so neither can move. This is all basic Bible study for GC 101, Phil. which is sufficiently powerful enough to hold the sun and all these satellite planets doing a 24 hour orbit around it, without even showing a wobble. Yeah, the firmament - steady as she goes, cap'n. Do all these planets keep the same distance from the sun as it traverses this 24 hour daily 190 million mile diameter path around the earth? Of course not. Kepler found the planets move in ellipses. If so then they all would be seen to do 190million mile 24 hour circles of their own virtually around nothing.. Why consider the Sun nothing? Planets move as the firmament compels them. Here's food for thought: We know 2 instances of the Sun's motion being interrupted: Joshua's long day and Fatima.. The planetary motions were not affected in either case, sooooooooooo Doesn't that mean that the Sun does not control the planets, but something else does?? RU thinking, Phil? RB Philip.. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.476 / Virus Database: 269.10.22/923 - Release Date: 27/07/2007 6:01 PM