[geocentrism] Re: Further on Aspden
- From: "philip madsen" <pma15027@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: "geocentrism list" <geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Mon, 9 Jul 2007 13:45:44 +1000
Robert your email is complicated
take this as a section internal of cylindrical plates. Note
RB: where??
Lots like this Robert! What happened to the diagrams and the colors I sent you
.. have you altered your reader?
will try to resend with diagrams if you did not get them before.. .
Philip.
----- Original Message -----
From: Robert Bennett
To: Geocentrism
Sent: Monday, July 09, 2007 12:03 PM
Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Further on Aspden
Hi all! I apologise to all for spacing things out.. My eyes get lost when
things are all bunched up together..
Thank you Robert for your reply, and showing me a couple of shortcomings in
my query.. Which was to establish a rough capacitance value, that needs to
have a reasonable value for practical purposes before I venture into
construction project. I will do it anyway as it costs only time.
In another post I did think I had briefly touched on Aspdens aether
hypothesis. There is such an enormous amount of work he published, that I
needed to condense it or rather take out what is pertinent.
Before I go below and answer your specific queries, I will express further
what I gather he has said in my simple terminology. You can convert the quanta
into quantum physics as you may.
First of all as you have referred to the Adams motor example which deals with
magnetic field rotation, it is necessary to relate the two, magnetic and
electrostatic fields. It helps to go back momentarily to the ancient domain
theory for explanation sake.
Magnetic fields are always dependent upon the existence of electrical
phenomena, essentially a moving electrostatic field. Magnetic phenomena can not
and does not exist of itself..
We no longer separate the electro magnet and ferrite or permanent magnet as
two different species. The ferrite magnet is as an electro magnet, in that the
molecular domains are aligned such that the electrons of certain atoms are "in
phase" as regards physical rotation, such that their movements present a
similar orientation in space to moving electrons or current in a solenoid
inductance, producing the magnetic field.
Aspden considered that the aether had an electrical structure. I repeat his
words here.
"The point I want to make is that Veronnet saw the aether as having
electrical structure and an underlying quantized angular motion akin the (to)
that (what) we learn of from Bohr's theory. Veronnet realised that jitter
motion in the aether could perhaps explain why electrons in atoms have a
quantized angular momentum, that is, why they have specific energy quanta
linked to their rotation."
From other things said, and given this diagram, I gather that Aspden assumes
the aether to be a nonmaterial state of positive and negative charges, which in
the normal situation are neutral. He seems to indicate that these are of a
certain size and density , (is that quantised? ) and further that there is a
rotation assumed to be the negative charge around a positive nucleus. We are
dealing here in only two dimensions, as he does not indicate the position in
three. This state is similar to the basic atom of proton and electron, except
we have no mass involved..
I am not dismayed by this concept, as I have often wondered at the Radio
Frequency standing wave in space. Here we have a state of vibrating energy
composed of an electrical line of force equivalent to a separated positive and
negative charge in the space occupied, as well as the accompanying magnetic
field at right angles to it. As you no doubt know all this, this wave is
created in space between a propagating beam antennae and a reflecting beam
antenna separated half wavelength in space. . So we can have a non material
structure of pure energy.
Ok so now I will dive into the points you raised below.. inserted in brown..
That is conservation of energy, as brown is just one space away from the black
on my chart.
----- Original Message -----
From: Robert Bennett
To: geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Saturday, July 07, 2007 4:02 AM
Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Further on Aspden
Here is a request to the math professors here. To save me digging into my
ancient Duncan & starling, and considering I'm rusty on the capacitor formula ,
without the hype jump to metric units,
within the vacuum structure of Aspden's aether, what would you consider the
capacitance to be if I used a gallon glass bottle, say 10 inches OD and !2
inches high, guess 0.25 inch thick glass, the dielectric , the constant of
which can be anywhere between
Glass
3.8
14.5
air is 1 (so what is a vacuum) on which I paste an alfoil sheet, and
inside a connection electrode immersed in a strongly conducting solution of say
H2SO4 or maybe salt..
Before I go to the manufacturing stage.. If this is suitable, my meter will
give me the mfd ezactly.
The working asssumption here is that the Aspden effect is caused by aether
being dragged by the mechanical rotor or the spinning magnetic field into a
spinning state.
I have not yet found anything to indicate he claimed the mechanical rotor
dragged the aether.
RB:other aether experiments seem to indicate so.
Going on what I said above, instead, we may consider the spinning magnet as
consisting also of a spinning electrostatic field. The magnetism is just a side
property of the electric field. It is the rotation of the electrical field that
is more likely to effect an electrical structure of which he claims the aether
is composed. .
Therefore if there is any rotating influence the prime influence is
electrical not the physical material of the rotor. Of course I have not yet
looked at the interaction of motion of matter and enertia within this aether
sructure, and Aspden has much more written yet to be read. But perhaps it is
hinted in these words.(it) could perhaps explain why electrons in atoms have a
quantized angular momentum, that is, why they have specific energy quanta
linked to their rotation." Indeed! The whole physical world is imbedded in and
dependent for existence within this medium.
How does your capacitor represent a viable analog of this effect?
Not an analog.
RB: so there's no mechanical motion, unlike the Aspden effect?
The capacitor because of its cylindrical form, creates due to electrical
stress , a rotation of electrical charge because as shown,
RB: where?
the outer rotating negative charge is brought into uniform alignment, not
normal to the aether when no charge was present.
take this as a section internal of cylindrical plates. Note
RB: where??
the off
centre of the charge. between the plates, compared to the normal aether.
This suddenly brings to my mind that if such was happening, there would be an
indicating magnetic field. to be investigated. Remembering this is with a
steady DC voltage charge applied. No current. Back to Mr. Brown. So I could
conceive the spinning rotor with its spinning electron charge field, possibly
interfering and causing a similar state in the aether, as does the charged
capacitor. Simply put, the capacitor is a simple way of proving the mechanism
of this aether structure, but it may require to be done in a vacuum.
RB: Isn't the rotation (if it exists) only momentary - within the time
constant?
Are you saying that each charge and discharge cycle should become
easier/faster?
Well we are beginning with a single unchanging state of charge due to applied
DC , which Aspden claims will create the appearance of a rotation electrical
charge. Very much in the same way we have an apparent rotation of charge around
the "solenoid" of a permanent magnet..
RB: but the solenoid is continuous rotation; this is transient flow.
there being no actual movement of electrons, even so this is just assumed. As
the charges have no weight, there is nothing to preclude an actual rotation.
RB: or to assume one.
And this can be taken as a two way street likened to the ion flows in an
electrolyte. Thus I was not yet into reversals such as the application of AC..
To answer your question, AC should find this action or effect as an electrical
hysteresis load analogus to the hysteresis loss due to retentivity in
transformer iron.
RB: AC would simulate an oscillating motion of the rotor, not rotation? Each
AC reversal wouild reverse the aether drag, with a net effect of zero...... no
hysteresis?!
But there's no rotation, which seems to be the key ingredient; linear
motions don't (seem to) drag the aether. I am leaving alone all thoughts
concerning overall aether movement as regards the universe. We are here really
only considering the aether , its structure, and movements of or within its
components, which Aspden claims are merely in normal state a neutrally balanced
system of positive and negative charges.
Why are you constructing a custom condenser. why not use a standard one
off-the-shelf?
If you look at the structure of any normal capacitor, you will see that it is
a cylinder, but it is composed of a number of concentric rings. In these
circumstance you will have the electrical field going in both directions either
side of any element. this would result in aether charge rotation in both
directions which overall would be a neutral result. I had to quickly draw a
couple of intertwined spirals or cylinders to get the picture. The first
capacitors were leyden jars, which did not have this form, and no doubt this
may have contributed to some amazing experimental readings, which modern
science will today discount. Dr Aspden was quick to point this out, and why it
has to be a leyden jar type . Tesla also !
That was just a guess. I remember vaguely student days an explanation of a
phenomenon which I forget the name, but apparently if a capacitor was fully
discharged, left a moment, it would of itself build up some charge again. This
was explained as due to some delay within the dielectric needed for the atoms
to return completely to the normal unstressed state..Thinking about it today
right now, maybe it was something else..
RB: Could be - why not pursue that idea - sounds simple.
Btw: Aspden should have moved the motor a few feet away from the first run
position to test if the second run performance depends on the location of the
first run.
With current thinking it should.
Yes. I think so. maybe for a different reason. Everything is aether
influenced, and everything may influence the aether in some way. Even the time
of the day, taking Millers figures, and Maurice Allaise ' interpretations of
them, gravity was a big factor. I have yet to get into Maurice stuff yet , not
much is in English..
Assuming Aspden is correct, and if I can ignore the glass, the aether will
begin to rotate if I connect an available 20kV DC to charge the thing.
RB: You have an electrician's license? 20 kv is nothing to fool with.
My problem, not having a scope is to measure the total charge (energy watts)
component against that released on discharge.
Why will the aether rotate??
Sorry lazy work.. I meant if the components of the aether within the cylinder
dielectric rotated as Aspden expects. But now as realised above some magnetic
field should be evident, because any flow of charge has to be accompanied by
such.
However, if I were to connect a very low R inductance making a parallel
circuit that resonates at an available kHz frequency, If there was negligible
damping, which seems to be obviously impossible using an electrolyte on one
plate, we should see surplus energy if the oscillations are sustained without
further supply input.. or I could measure the temperature increase..
RB: This nothing more than AC - see above...
The charge and discharge cycle accelerates electrons, so EM radiation energy
will be created.. How will you measure it?
Thats true, but if we keep the frequency down this may not be of
importance.. It has to be a perfect resonant circuit with no harmonic
distortions. I have no intentions of being the threat that Tesla was , in
colarado, was it.
I have also to consider the effect this alleged aether component rotation has
on the time constant which in the standard formula is only a factor of C and R.
Wouldn't this aether rotation also cause a sort of hysteresis component of
load were I to use Alternating current.
RB: I don't follow...
Finally the modern chart here seems to make the dielectric constant of air 1
which I vaguely remember was considered to be that of a vacuum. It cant be
identical.
Now its getting complicated..
Amen
I await anybody suggestions.
Phil.
PS I am sure though , that if this aether is proven, we still cannot accept
that there is any aether drift that supports geocentrism (complete immobility
of the world) as Millers figures went more to support the opposite.. or we are
left with the current position, the aether is moving and we are stationary, or
the reverse.. Still be nice though to upset their egos and extract some of
that ether magic.
Miller showed there was a relative motion of earth and aether; why was earth
motion better supported ?
If aether isn't dragged by linear motion through it (but causes inertia, of
course), then the CMB dipole and other modern exps that detect the linear
motion of Earth toward points in the sky are misconstrued.
The motion is opposite; the celestial points must be moving toward Earth.
Miller was able to show that the aether drift was at 200k/s at his Mt wilson
location, and its max, thus indicated the direction. This velocity is far in
excess of the relatively slower speeds attributed to the earths movement
relative to its solar orbit and rotation. Miller took no note of these for
deriving proof of geocentrism, he was a heliocentrist, except to include them
in (by assumption of known figures I guess) in arriving at the net figure of
200.k's, as such speed vectors would be relative to the time of the day, and
the position of the earth around the sun. this is why I said "he is no help to
us. But he certainly helped confirm the universe according to Hoyle. Tata..
This will all be filed for future compression.
Robert anybody
And what about doing that sum for me Robert. C = csa x k / thickmess or
For example, the capacitance of a parallel-plate capacitor constructed of two
parallel plates of area A separated by a distance d is approximately equal to
the following:
where
C is the capacitance in farads, F
e is the permittivity of the insulator used (or e0 for a vacuum)
A is the area of each plate, measured in square metres
d is the separation between the plates, measured in metres
The equation is a good approximation if d is small compared to the other
dimensions of the plates.
in microfarads please. Phil
RB; need the epsilon value of the glass, Phil...
Robert
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