"I think it would be good if Dr Jones could SIMM this in GU 2005." Good suggestion, Allen, I'll see what we can do. Neville. Allen Daves <allendaves@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: Since the Earth is not moving in a GS model and in the HC it is moving around the sun, the only way star trails could appear in a GS model is if the whole universe was vibrating around the earth over a period of one year with a 3% elliptical and a ~150 million mile radius. But there are no star trails, which excludes the possibility of the earth moving around the sun. As Dr Jones points out, if the nightly star trails are due to a ~7000 mile circle (spin) of the earth then the 300,000,000 mile circle that the earth makes around the sun should produce annual star trails that are ~42,000 thousand times larger than the nightly ones. If the nightly star trails are due to a say ~.0000005 of a degree angle between the observer and the star and that produces a star trail that is say ~.5 inch across (in the sky)over the course of one night then over the course a year it should produce one~43,000 times that size or ~21,500 inches in dia, because the nightly circle is only ~7000 miles big in diameter, the yearly is ~300,000,000 million miles big. How could it not be there? But it is not there! If ~3500 miles (Earth?s Radius)represents .0000005 of a degree at 430lys, then the angle of the observer after moving 300,000,000 miles away would change drastically from .0000005 of one degree to ~.214 of a degree from where it was before. I?m not using trig here just REAL ROUGH numbers off the top of my head. In any case it is a big difference. I think it would be good if Dr Jones could SIMM this in GU 2005. Allen Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com