[GeoStL] Re: Tennessee Cemetery & Burial Site Laws

  • From: "Jim Bensman" <junkmailno@xxxxxxxxxxx>
  • To: <geocaching@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2008 16:19:55 -0600

I think this is just a symptom of the private property issue.  I suspect
just like parking lots, most people do not consider cemeteries private
property.  I think geocaching.com should do a better job on explaining what
kinds of places are usually private property and pointing out permission is

I also like Mike's suggestion of having a form that has to be filled out for
private property.  Then you could have the form on the cache page.  Any
chance this could happen?

I remember a cache (I think in Bloomington IL).  It was on a golf course.
To get to it you had to cross a no trespassing sign.  If you followed the
directions in the cache, you crossed a no trespassing sign.  I did not do
the cache as there was no way to get to it without crossing a no trespassing
sign.  I was shocked at how many people just ignored the no trespassing
sign.  While after I reported the no trespassing sign the cache was
archived, I felt all the finds should have been deleted.  

There was a cache in a Denver shopping mall.  I went to it.   There were
buildings, a road, then a wall with a no trespassing sign on one side, then
some bushes and grass on the other side of the wall.  The GPS zeroed out at
the no trespassing sign.  The cache page did not mention the no trespassing
sign and there were about 100 finds.  I left and posted a note pointing out
the no trespassing sign and asking if there was permission, and indicating
it needed to be addressed on the cache page.  They responded by deleting the
note and ignoring the issue.  So I posted a should be archived with a
picture of the no trespassing sign.  That got deleted and I reposted.
Someone else was also posting it should be shut down and contacting gc.com
and getting pretty nasty when the response was to delete the log.  The CO
Administer said the cache was on the side of the wall without the no
trespassing sign but would not address if they had permission to place it
there from the shopping center.  Nor would CO administrator require them to
address the no trespassing sign on the cache page.  I think there were also
threats if we posted more complaints about the failure to address the no
trespassing sign we would get banned.  I think that might have happened to
the other person.  The cache eventually got archived. Its been a while since
this happened so the details may be a bit wrong.  

Its doing stupid things like this that risks us getting banned. 

Jim Bensman
"Nature Bats Last" 

> -----Original Message-----
> From: geocaching-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:geocaching-
> bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Glenn Nash
> Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2008 3:07 PM
> To: geocaching@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: [GeoStL] Re: Tennessee Cemetery & Burial Site Laws
> -
> Sure Geocaching prompted this.
> Caches in cemeteries have been  tricky things. Most folks are respectful
> and all that but, (there is always a but) others are not. There was a
> cache in Tennessee that required the cacher to move the burial stone
> somehow to retrieve the cache. This was a couple years ago. Poor taste,
> lots of upset people ect. In (I think Ohio) cachers were running a bit
> of a competition with caches in cemeteries. Very poorly done.
> While cemetery caches are just fine -- they're among my favorite type of
> cache to hunt because I love the history and the opertunity to chat with
> the old folks,   I try to be very careful about listing anything that is
> too close to a grave.
> With the pending legislation in South Carolina that would criminalize
> geocaches in cemeteries, everyone has been  taking a closer look at all
> caches located in cemeteries. It seems that Tennessee has now signed on
> to banning them.  While the guidelines still permit them, we  *really *
> want to make sure that they not placed in a manner that will reflect
> poorly on our sport.
> With caches in cemeteries (as with any cache), you should obtain
> permission from the caretaker. For cemeteries that are private property,
> this is required.  In the case of a church cemetery that would be the
> pastor, in the case of a city cemetery probably a municipal employee.
> We ask this since graveyard hides are often in sensitive areas -
> particularly if people are still being interred or if relatives are
> still visiting those buried in the past. It becomes less of a concern if
> the cemetery is old and little more than a historic site, but we still
> want to play it safe, not give our sport any negative press.
> Caches should not be on, or near graves. If its an active cemetery, its
> best to place them on the fringes of the cemetery where searchers are
> unlikely to encounter mourners. Woods bordering a cemetery are a safe
> bet.
> Its also a good idea to place it in a manner where people will not be
> required to walk over graves.
> Cemetery caches are controversial in some quarters and we need to be as
> sensitive as possible when placing these caches. We do not want to give
> any more state's legislatures a reason to look at this issue.
> Benjamin Gross wrote:
> > -
> > I've been wondering when this would happen. Some cemeteries are great
> > for caches, but I've always been leery of micros in trees among the
> graves.
> > Did geocaching prompt this, or is it coincidence?
> >
> > ""play at any game or amusement therein""
> > This wording makes it seem like they want to force cemeteries to be
> > depressing.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Jan 10, 2008, at 3:22 PM, Glenn wrote:
> >
> >> -
> >> It is just a matter of time before other states jump in.
> >>
> >> Tennessee Geocaching Polices and Guidelines
> >>
> >> NO CACHES IN Cemeteries
> >>
> >> Law concerning caches in cemeteries, geocaching is a game.
> >>
> >> Tennessee Cemetery & Burial Site Laws
> >> Statutory Laws
> >>
> >> (Tennessee Code Annotated)
> >> Title 46. Cemeteries
> >> 46-2-105. Crimes and offenses
> >> No person shall willfully destroy, deface, or injure any monument,
> >> tomb, gravestone, or other structure placed in the cemetery, or any
> >> roadway, walk, fence or enclosure in or around the same, or injure
> any
> >> tree, plant or shrub therein, or hunt or shoot therein, play at any
> >> game or amusement therein, or loiter for lascivious or lewd purposes
> >> therein, or interfere, by words or actions, with any funeral
> >> procession or any religious exercises.
> >>
> >> (B) A violation of this section is a Class E felony. ,
> >> Class E Felony 1 to 6 years $3,000
> >> Those caches that are in cemeteries now are grandfathered in unless
> >> there is a complaint ..
> >>
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 For List Info or To make _ANY_ changes, including unsubscribing from this
 list, click -----> http://www.freelists.org/list/geocaching 
 Missouri Caches Scheduled to be Archived  http://tinyurl.com/87cqw

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