[geekcrypt] Re: WAS Re: Introducing frehberg, or Frank

  • From: Bill Cox <waywardgeek@xxxxxxxxx>
  • To: geekcrypt@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
  • Date: Fri, 6 Jun 2014 00:53:09 -0400

On Thu, Jun 5, 2014 at 11:29 PM, Karen Palen <karenpalensl@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

>  Bill,
> I would suggest you look closely at an LLC (Limited Liability Corporation)
> which is available in every US State and all 10 Canadian Provinces. They
> are specifically designed for "small businesses/organizations" so the
> hassle is minimal.

Actually, it's even simpler than that for organizations that have no
income.  My wife and I are very entrepreneurial, and I sold the Chapter C
Corp we started together four years ago.  We had a heck of an argument over
LLC vs Chapter C, and in the end I won because of my argument that all the
old guys who want to invest already understand Chapter C stock.  Her next
venture was an LLC.

Anyway, here in North Carolina, staring a no-income non-profit is as easy
as copyrighting a document.  You just have to declare that you are doing so
to others, basically.  There is no need for creating any formal legal
status.  A lot of organizations fall into this category, like bike clubs
for example.

I would prefer that this organization be a similar simple non-profit in
another country, where dark suits don't show up at your door demanding

> I would definitely suggest several "owners"/members (so no one can claim
> it is a sham), although a single "manager" is fine.
> I have set up and run nearly a dozen LLCs in Arizona for investment
> purposes; that is where the bulk of my retirement savings is kept.
> If an Arizona LLC is acceptable to you, I can set one up for you in an
> afternoon, for about $125 in out of pocket fees. Since you wouldn't be
> "doing business" you shouldn't need anything more, but you would need a Tax
> ID number (and file an Income tax return) until you get a "non-profit"
> ruling from the IRS however. This return would simply show any donations
> (or whatever) plus declare any expenses.

Thanks for the offer!  At some point, if against my recommendations we have
income, we may need help creating an LLC or non-profit.

> While YOU can't stop the "dark suits" a lawyer certainly can and often
> does that is part of the job. Trouble is the lawyer needs to know what is
> happening so they can "dive right in" and get whatever stopped (or
> reversed).

The Lavabit guy I think would disagree.  Lawyers who understand the threat
of an NSL are rare, and typically hard to find locally.  The EFF is an
exception, and maybe we should talk to them, though not at the expense of
slowing down progress.

> The recent revelations about the NSA destroying evidence in a lawsuit with
> the EFF is a good illustration.
> As a one time "techno geek" I understand your reluctance to involve
> lawyer, but as an investor I fully understand the importance of having the
> right things filed in the right places with various "panic buttons"
> attached in case someone decides to ignore the law. Just in the past year
> alone this strategy has saved me well over $100K in spurious demands for
> payment for example.

As a prior business owner, I understand!  I feel strongly that this project
should avoid money.  None of the evil stuff I've seen in business would
have happened were it not for the desire for more money, and we may
encounter more bad guys in  crypto land than we usually find in business

> The suggestion that EFF be involved seems like a good one though, they
> certainly have had much experience with the "dark suits" and won more often
> than they have lost!

I can be talked into contacting the EFF.  Is this something you might be
interested in doing?  I think I would be next on that list, and I'd prefer
to let you do it :-)


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