Re: [foxboro] [EXTERNAL] Re: FDSI Issue

From: "Pulas, Philip G." <PGPulas@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: "foxboro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx" <foxboro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2023 19:21:35 +0000

And Iâm hoping something will be done to come out with a like-in-kind FDSI
replacement so that our company doesnât bring up the conversation of
converting us to Honeywell again.
Thanks,
Philip Pulas
Foxboro Steering Committee Chairman

From: foxboro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <foxboro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> On Behalf Of
Long, Brian
Sent: Thursday, June 1, 2023 11:34 AM
To: foxboro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [foxboro] [EXTERNAL] Re: FDSI Issue

Sadly, fully agree with both. Taking this option away will force us to change
vendors. Brian -----Original Message----- From:
foxboro-bounce@âfreelists.âorg <foxboro-bounce@âfreelists.âorg> On
Behalf Of foxpat Sent: Wednesday, May 31, 2023

Sadly, fully agree with both.  Taking this option away will force us to change
vendors.

Brian

-----Original Message-----

From: foxboro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:foxboro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
<foxboro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:foxboro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>> On Behalf
Of foxpat

Sent: Wednesday, May 31, 2023 4:16 PM

To: foxboro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:foxboro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>

Subject: Re: [foxboro] [EXTERNAL] Re: FDSI Issue

I fully agree with Philip.

It seems to me development department is not listening to customers.

It is not a matter of obsolete components for FDSI; just re-design with
available components with exact same form-factor and functionality. Surely this
can be done!

I think there would be sufficient market for FDSI to co-exist with FDC280.

I strongly feel SE is letting their customers down in this case and they try to
get away with it by just saying 'we are sorry'.

Well, so am I for this rant but I had to vent it at some point ....

Patrick Martens

Zeeland Refinery NL

-----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----

Van: foxboro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:foxboro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
[mailto:foxboro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] Namens Pulas, Philip G.

Verzonden: woensdag 31 mei 2023 16:18

Aan: foxboro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:foxboro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>

Onderwerp: Re: [foxboro] [EXTERNAL] Re: FDSI Issue

Marcel,

With the introduction of the FDSI FBM as a new replacement for the INT30, you
introduced a new architecture option that included placing the FDSI FBMs out in
the field away from a MESH connection. Now, Schneider is telling many customers
that they made a very bad infrastructure decisionÃ¢â¬âthat we were
encouraged to makeÃ¢â¬âbecause the INT30 replacement FDC280 didnÃ¢â¬â¢t
come out until ~20 years later. The cost difference between an FDC280 pair to
replace an FDSI FBM is not just the modules themselves, but the entire
infrastructure cost needs to install them needs to be considered when replacing
them with an FDC280. Now, weÃ¢â¬â¢ve put the FDSI FBMs out:

  1.  in the field over fiber (need to run new fiber to add FDC280 pair because
need to keep existing spare fiber used for FCM2f2s)

  2.  in the field over fieldbus cable on 200 Series baseplates attached to 100
Series migration racks (need to run new fiber to add FDC280 pair and most
likely a new cabinet just for the FDC280 because the 100 Series migration rack
fit just right)

  3.  in the field with the FCP280 (need to run new fiber to add FDC280 pair
because need to keep existing spare fiber used for FCP280)

In some cases we might need to run more power because we donÃ¢â¬â¢t have
enough, or need to replace smaller power supplies with larger power supplies
when non-Foxboro ones were used. We have a very large, distributed FDSI install
base and, where we have PLCs, almost always with additional 200 Series FBMs
because temperature and power monitoring through a PLC (like our Triconex SIS)
is much more expensive than through the DCS.

We probably have 40+ FDSI installs all in different areas with no possibility,
nor desire, to consolidate them. We have them segregated for a reason by
process unit, as our process units do not come down at the same time.

Thanks,

Philip Pulas

Foxboro Steering Committee Chairman

From: foxboro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:foxboro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
<foxboro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:foxboro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>> On Behalf
Of Marcel Rameil

Sent: Wednesday, May 31, 2023 6:01 AM

To: foxboro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:foxboro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>

Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [foxboro] FDSI Issue

Hi Brian, I agree with your point: The FDC280 is not a form-fit replacement for
the FDSI. It needs a pair of Mesh Control Network switch ports, adding one
needs a SysDef change and a committed install, the baseplate form factor is
different

Hi Brian,

I agree with your point: The FDC280 is not a form-fit replacement for the FDSI.
It needs a pair of Mesh Control Network switch ports, adding one needs a SysDef
change and a committed install, the baseplate form factor is different and we
need to change topology of fieldbus and Mesh Control Network cabling. When
existing FDSI infrastructures use a mix of hard wired and software tags in
logic together, they must be separated into different controllers when moving
from FDSI to FDC280. If they have been in the same compound, they have to be
moved to separate compounds with all the hassle and re-engineering controls,
HMI and historian that this needs - we are fully aware of all this.

You wrote:

If the FDC could support I/O it would be a non-issue!

[...]as we have no spare FBM230/231s

Gheyll wrote:

[...]it may be necessary to convert the Ethernet signal to RS485 and

use a FBM230/231

Do you know if it is possible for Schneider to develop a custom driver for
this use case?

We will definitely not develop anything for the FDSI platform, at some point we
need to stop riding a dead horse. ÃÂ°ÃÂ¸ÃÅÃ¢â¬Â° For the FDC280 however,
things are always possible - if there is a business case. Please work with your
Schneider Electric representative to discover options.

Hope this was helpful.

Let me know at any time, if you have any product strategy questions on the
Foxboro DCS.

Best regards - Liebe GrÃÆÃÂ¼ÃÆÃÂ¸e -

Marcel Rameil

Schneider Electric

Global Offer Manager Control Software, EcoStruxure Foxboro DCS Product
Marketing, Industry Business, Process Automation

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References:
- Re: [foxboro] [EXTERNAL] Re: FDSI Issue
  - From: Long, Brian

Re: [foxboro] [EXTERNAL] Re: FDSI Issue

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