Ok, I do not understand that the intention of the rules is what you interpret
but in any case if the battle is in Amsterdam and the surrounding area is
closed, then what happens there?
________________________________
From: eiagreek-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <eiagreek-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> on behalf
of Laertes Papaspyrou <bitoulis@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Tuesday, February 27, 2018 12:23:47 PM
To: eiagreek@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [eiagreek] Re: Rules clarification, Insurrection & Withdrawal ΙΙI
That's why there is the "if possible", it wont go South. It will go North
________________________________
From: Yannis Sykamias <ysykamias@xxxxxxxxxxx>
To: "eiagreek@xxxxxxxxxxxxx" <eiagreek@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Tuesday, 27 February 2018, 12:22
Subject: [eiagreek] Re: Rules clarification, Insurrection & Withdrawal ΙΙI
it is not a scenario but a very simple case.
An army/corps has to move out of an area towards its closest depot. Assume that
the closest depot is 3 areas south. Assume also the existence of an enemy corps
in the adjacent south area, how will the corps leaving the area move?
________________________________
From: eiagreek-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <eiagreek-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> on behalf
of Laertes Papaspyrou <bitoulis@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Tuesday, February 27, 2018 12:18
To: eiagreek@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [eiagreek] Re: Rules clarification, Insurrection & Withdrawal ΙΙI
Not sure what scenario you are questioning now. The army has to move to an
adjacent area. Do you want to discuss all possible scenarios in advance? Please
state all possible scenarios and we will discuss. Do we have to wait for this
for you to conclude your turn? Maybe it is worth considering that some are
obviously tired and would like to see some progress, so if we can do this is
parallel it would be to the benefit of the game.
Thanks
________________________________
From: Yannis Sykamias <ysykamias@xxxxxxxxxxx>
To: "eiagreek@xxxxxxxxxxxxx" <eiagreek@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Tuesday, 27 February 2018, 12:14
Subject: [eiagreek] Re: Rules clarification, Insurrection & Withdrawal ΙΙI
I do not find the proposed solution comfortable. If we are to search forum
discussions then why we haven't done it already for the current (insurrection)
issue that takes 4 days long discussions?
Since, we have already spent, at least, exhaustive time to discuss on this and
since as you said I am the only one (and possibly Dimitris S) with the
different understanding among the group, is this what you concluded?
________________________________
From: eiagreek-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <eiagreek-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> on behalf
of Laertes Papaspyrou <bitoulis@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Tuesday, February 27, 2018 12:04
To: eiagreek@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [eiagreek] Re: Rules clarification, Insurrection & Withdrawal ΙΙI
It moves out to an adjacent area.
I'm sure there are awkward cases, like having enemies ALREADY present in ALL
adjacent areas. I'm sure this has been discussed in a forum. Whoever is
interested please do a search and let us know.
________________________________
From: Yannis Sykamias <ysykamias@xxxxxxxxxxx>
To: "eiagreek@xxxxxxxxxxxxx" <eiagreek@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Tuesday, 27 February 2018, 11:56
Subject: [eiagreek] Re: Rules clarification, Insurrection & Withdrawal ΙΙI
now that we "resolved" the insurrection issue, will someone reply to my
question please?
________________________________
From: eiagreek-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <eiagreek-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> on behalf
of Yannis Sykamias <ysykamias@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Tuesday, February 27, 2018 10:49
To: eiagreek@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [eiagreek] Re: Rules clarification, Insurrection & Withdrawal ΙΙI
ok, since there is not going to be any other vote/discussion on this issue, i
just want someone to summarize how we will handle going forward the issue of
"move" as stated in 7.3.8.4 (since it is something we may encounter again in
the future and it is out of the scope of insurrection corps use). Will it be as
a withdraw or something else?
________________________________
From: eiagreek-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <eiagreek-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> on behalf
of Makis Xiroyannis <makis.xiroyannis@xxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Tuesday, February 27, 2018 10:33
To: eiagreek@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [eiagreek] Rules clarification, Insurrection & Withdrawal ΙΙI
Thread has broke for me again, I don't understand who sends what. So copying
the last message from Dimitris here
Gooooooooooooooooooodmorniiiii iiiiing Vienna!
και στης Βιέννης την αυλή σφάζονται παλικάρια!
BEWARE the Prussian GURU is going to speak:
dear Gentlemen
it is obvious that this discussion will last as long as we can stand it.
hopefully we are not going to find how much we still can stand it, so PLEASE
ALL just TRY to read the following
1) Yannis' interprets this situation as withdrawal. it includes the movement
element that triggers insurrection and turkish movement as withdrawal. this way
EVERYTHING WORKS FINE. no bugs, no back and forth, no inconsistencies, NOTHING.
everything is ABSOLUTELY FINE.
ONLY IF the rules were saying:
7.3.8.4 STEP FOUR: All major powers not at war with the attacker (except
the attacker and his allies at war with the defender and factors in cities or
on depots) must now leave the area, (moving) withdrawing to any adjacent area
that, if
possible, is closer or at least as close to their source of supply as the area
they leave.
Nothing wrong if ottoman army moves out of Austria (still travels less far than
Russian), nothing wrong if Austria moves everywhere he likes, NOTHING wrong if
France fight alone NOTHING.
2) Makis initial thought (from last turn) about which movement triggers
insurrection corps was VALID. IF insurrection corps appear only as a result of
normal land movement then EVERYTHING WORKS FINE. Again, no bugs, no
inconsistencies, NOTHING. ONLY if the rules were saying:
10.1.4.1 PLACING INSURRECTION CORPS: Immediately after an enemy
corps, cossack or freikorps has entered certain Austrian border provinces
during movement phase ,
the triggers the possible placement of the insurrection corps and the
Austrian player may (if desired) place on-map either or both insurrection
corps anywhere within that province, at their current strength.
Nothing wrong if Austria will not be able to raise with insurrection, nothing
wrong if Austria will not force ottoman army to move further, nothing wrong if
Prussia fight alone NOTHING.
UNFORTUNATELLY these yellows are not in the rules, that’s why this is happening
3) We are watching the last days a remarkable effort from both sides to raise
arguments, make interpretations etc. EVERYTHING was extremely USEFUL proving a
high level of knowledge, respect to each player and efforts to PERSUADE each
other. Since we are not persuaded after 4 days WE WILL NEVER DO.
4) Every attempt to find a solution showed GREAT WILL to somehow compromise the
situation and move forward. BUT UNFORTUNATELY IT IS OBVIOUS that anything
between 1) and 2) DOESN'T WORK.
therefore, to me the only dilemma should be
[A] Insurrection corps appear at any type of movement into Austrian territory
etc. AND ally forced movement out of the city follows withdrawal procedure
[B] Insurrection corps appear only during normal movement
and since Democracy doesn't have dilemmas lets vote on the above.
Democracy might also not produce always the right and just result, but at least
it is what the majority wants and the thing goes on.
I strongly believe that Yannis has covered adequately case [A] and i vor for it
thanks for your attendance.
You are dismissed and free to return back to your lines, grab your muskets and
LET's ROLL!!!!!
Dimitri, thank you for your input, it has a merit, but for me it is late now to
propose a third voting, I already said the previous voting suggested by Yannis
was the last one for me. In addition, the majority wants to play with the
spawning of insurrection anytime but without forcing the initiating corps to
retreat. So we play it like that. No need after 2 votings and 4 days of
discussion to start another round that will again replace the previous one we
have discussed/voted.
Lets play on.
