[dungeoncrawl] Re: Tuesday morning review
- From: "Robert Deibler" <rdeibler@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <dungeoncrawl@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Tue, 3 Dec 2002 12:55:08 -0500
Yeah right this is just a DMs cool to keep the green hair elf down. I think we
should join a Characters Union to keep our rights free from the oppressive
dictator called the DM.
Did anyone see the new Battle sheets out on TSRs site, Just thought I would
point those out, they are kinda cool.
-----Original Message-----
From: Damon Kline [mailto:damon.kline@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]
Sent: Tue 12/3/2002 12:45 PM
To: 'dungeoncrawl@xxxxxxxxxxxxx'
Cc:
Subject: [dungeoncrawl] Re: Tuesday morning review
Yeah, I think this group is well suited to take on the task at hand and
succeed. They are well designed and should be able to do this. I just
want
to make sure that as players, you don't think "Okay, we have to rush in
and
destroy all of the villains, so that we can get the hell out of this
cursed
underdark!". That may end up getting your characters killed.
Oh, next week should be tough, hopefully. I hope you don't take it as a
spanking for criticizing my DMing skills because I would never do such a
thing as to have the party beset on all sides by powerful minions with
nothing better to do than decorate their walls with PC hides... was I
rambling?
Seriously though, I came up with an idea for next week after I got home
last
night and I just want to say now, that it is not in retaliation for any
comments stated today. It is what I perceive as a natural progression
of
events, based on actions from the characters. We'll see how it goes.
:)
-----Original Message-----
From: Robert Deibler [mailto:rdeibler@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]
Sent: Tuesday, December 03, 2002 12:35 PM
To: dungeoncrawl@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [dungeoncrawl] Re: Tuesday morning review
I agree bad nights happen, the next nights usually better, if we were
the
type of people to let those nights affect us we would definaltly not be
playing as long as we have been... Face it there are basiclly two
types of
bad night, Bad Dice nights, Bad roleplaying nights, and when those two
are
the same night ouch...I am looking forward to see how the group faces
this
beholder...
Good point though Damon to many games I have played make it through by a
thin thread of life, but in reality they should have retreated
regrouped and
tried again versus keep bashing it out. Three of fights like that and
they
are ready for retirement.
-----Original Message-----
From: Damon Kline [mailto:damon.kline@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]
Sent: Tue 12/3/2002 12:21 PM
To: 'dungeoncrawl@xxxxxxxxxxxxx'
Cc:
Subject: [dungeoncrawl] Re: Tuesday morning review
Yes, it makes perfect sense. I didn't mean to imply that she
now
trusts him
implicitly and would risk her life for him. I just meant that
things have
no changed, for better or worse.
Let's be honest, last night was an off night. Nothing more,
nothing
less.
I wasn't completely in the game because I wasn't feeling well
and
that
really hampered things.
I also just realized that I forgot to have Erebus tell you
something
that I
needed the group to know. Damn.
We are going to have these every now and then. I think it is
standing out
so much because we don't often have these kind of nights with
this
group and
since we only play once a week, it makes each session that much
more
important.
Hopefully I'll be feeling better next week and I can pull off my
plan
better.
One thing I would caution though, in the weeks and months to
come,
as the
party delves deeper into this and finds more things out, please
remember
that retreat and regroup is an option. Too often we tend to
think
that the
DM won't kill the entire party or that the party can take
anything,
especially with eight characters. (I know we did that with the
Riders on a
few occasions.) You may be able to do a direct assault and
take out
all of
the bad guys in one shot and be done, but I would SERIOUSLY
doubt
that would
happen. As players, just don't make the mistake of thinking
that
your
characters will be able to triumph over anything. Unless your
character
thinks that! I'm not saying not to roleplay. If your character
would
legitimately not retreat from a certain situation, that is fine,
just
remember that it is an option. It's not so much that the party
is
being set
up to fail, it's just that it may take more than one big hurrah
to
end this.
:)
-----Original Message-----
From: Robert Deibler [mailto:rdeibler@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]
Sent: Tuesday, December 03, 2002 12:05 PM
To: dungeoncrawl@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [dungeoncrawl] Re: Tuesday morning review
It changes how Tori looks at him now but the trust factor is
still
not
there. It was a bummer we had to leave when we did she just
killed
the one
on Kage and it woudl have been intresting to see what would
transire
after
that. The mood and time is lost for next week but it would have
been
intresting, Even though he is a "druid" she still assisted all
other
characters first then went to Kage, She is looking at his
diffrently
but at
the same time he is still Kage and has done nothing her book to
mark
a
dramatic new start. His story could just be that a story. The
fact
he is a
nature lover might be a a notch in teh favorable direction but
there
is teh
last few days to get over and that real bad first impression.
To her
thi
scould all be a test, and just because Ivan checked him (if he
is
indeed a
paladin), he did give off an evil tendency. So she will have to
keep
an eye
on him. They really did not have time to talk in length to make
any
new
assesment on each other.
Make any sense...
-----Original Message-----
From: Damon Kline
[mailto:damon.kline@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]
Sent: Tue 12/3/2002 11:53 AM
To: 'dungeoncrawl@xxxxxxxxxxxxx'
Cc:
Subject: [dungeoncrawl] Re: Tuesday morning review
I do agree with John, in that last night just didn't
hit the
mark as
we
usually do. Matt was not feeling well and I was
getting the
beginnings of
what he has. (Which I now have in full.) :) I know
that
Jim was
distracted due to issues at home and at work.
Are these excuses for a very off night? Perhaps, but I
believe that
we have
overcome other things like this in the past. I think
that
the
biggest
problem that we faced was that I was not into it last
night.
Because I
wasn't feeling well, I wasn't thinking sharply. About
half-way
through the
fight at the end, I realized that John had no characters
there and
was
basically sitting there doing nothing. That is
certainly
not the
kind of
time that I had in mind.
Role-playing was off, big time, but I think that was
due to
a few
circumstances. Matt was not feeling well at all and
that
hurt his
characters, because he couldn't bring them across as
vividly
as he
normally
does. With the exception of Neris playing up that
wound in
the
fight, that
was great. I think also that John came in with the
expectation that
a big
revelation or change was going to happen.
Understandable,
since we
did hype
it up in that way throughout the week. When he found
out
that it
was just
some stupid info from Erebus and Kage getting turned
into a
druid
again, he
was let down and his characters showed that. When Kage
tried to
explain
things about what had happened, Cullen and Whilce were
both
like
"Whatever,
we're bored, who cares." I think that was a reflection
of
John's
disappointment at the revelation. Truly, it was more
of a
revelation for
Kage than for anyone else, but I think it will have some
interesting
effects
on the group dynamic. It changes how Tori and Kage
interact, it
changes
Kage's spell selections, his ability to swap spells for
healing and
his
ability to turn undead. It will affect his personality,
which
affects the
group as well. Now, these things are more subtle
changes,
so there
really
wasn't any big revelation. Perhaps it shouldn't have
been
built up
as much.
In the end, it is my responsibility to "take charge" and
make sure
everyone
has a good time. Now, certainly even if I am doing a
good
job, if
the
players aren't into it, it hurts. But, if the DM isn't
into
it,
unless you
want a night of complete character driven role-playing,
no
one is
going to
have a good time.
-----Original Message-----
From: Johnathan Detrick [mailto:jdetrick@xxxxxxxxxxx]
Sent: Tuesday, December 03, 2002 11:43 AM
To: dungeoncrawl@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [dungeoncrawl] Re: Tuesday morning review
Yeah, I guess you could take the e-mail as singling
you
out as
the
problem child. Not intentional, that's for sure. There
isn't any
way
that one person could be responsible for a night like
last
night.
It
takes group suckiness to sink to the depths we sank to.
I'm sure that I probably had a worse time of it than
anyone
else,
but then, I also spent the end of the night doing
nothing.
jimkaren@xxxxxxxxxxxx wrote:
> Well, I feel a bit better, anyway. If
> you read your original email, it sure
> does look that way! :)
>
> To be honest, on two occasions last
> night, I felt like I was focusing too
> much on your characters to the
> detriment of Matt and Bobby. And I
> didn't mean what I said about "stopping
> playing to download stuff" seriously -
> I was just amazed at what's possible on
> PCs in an area that I was never aware
> of.
>
> It wasn't personal - Karen suffers from
> my geek syndrome all the time. :)
>
> My biggest concern is identifying areas
> where we can improve to keep everyone
> interested - I can help by remaining
> focused. I have one confession to
> make, though - it's really tough for me
> to make the time to read the 3rd
> edition books.
>
> If I could do that, I'd also be
> certified on about half a dozen
> technical areas as well. I'm just
> interested in too much stuff, with too
> little time to read everything. I'll
> always have characters who can't even
> use their own feats -
>
> >
> > I didn't mean to single you out
> as being the one that was a
> > problem. When I was writing it, when
> I was there last night, and when I
> > was driving home thinking about it,
> not once did I think, "Jim is the
> > problem." It was not in my mind.
> > You are correct, we do get
> together to have fun. But in the end, I
> > did not have fun last night.
> Usually, when I leave after we play, I
> > have had a blast. Last night, when I
> left, I had about three things I
> > would rather have done with my
> night. And that depressed me.
> > Again, I don't single Jim out.
> That wouldn't be accurate and it
> > wouldn't be fair.
> >
> > jimkaren@xxxxxxxxxxxx wrote:
> >
> > > Yes, you definitely got me on that
> > > one. I have to admit, Matt made me
> > > aware of something that really blew
> me
> > > away - it was just an honest
> reaction.
> > > I was also a bit petrified about job
> > > security last night - a lame excuse
> in
> > > a sense, but it was a distraction.
> > >
> > > I noticed in your original email
> that
> > > Matt & Damon were exempted for being
> > > ill, and that Bobby did what you
> > > expected - sorry for letting you
> down.
> > > But bottom line, aren't we just
> getting
> > > together to have fun anyway?
> > >
> > > >
> > > > There was some role-playing
> > > towards the end of the evening, but
> it
> > > > was not important enough to
> warrant
> > > my presence. I can at least name
> > > > one time you ignored me. Cullen
> was
> > > addressing the group, and during
> > > > that you and Matt started looking
> at
> > > the computer and discussing it.
> > > >
> > > > jimkaren@xxxxxxxxxxxx wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > I agree it wasn't the best
> night,
> > > but I
> > > > > thought it went OK, anyway. Do
> you
> > > > > mean ignored role-playing wise,
> or
> > > > > ignored story/interaction wise?
> > > > >
> > > > > At least on my part, I remember
> Kage
> > > > > interacting with Cullen about
> the
> > > fight
> > > > > the last time, and Alturo with
> > > Cullen
> > > > > about the use of "fascinate".
> > > > >
> > > > > Kage also tried to start a
> > > discussion
> > > > > about Thor with Whilce -
> mostly, I'm
> > > > > trying to find out how I ignored
> > > you?
> > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Synopsis:
> > > > > > After the battle last time
> > > with
> > > > > the driders, the Sigil was
> > > > > > discussing the need for
> > > leadership.
> > > > > During the discussion, Erebus
> > > > > > appeared in an illusionary
> form.
> > > > > Apparently it was difficult and
> > > > > > painful for him to manifest,
> but
> > > he
> > > > > was able to inform the group
> that
> > > > > > they were not on Toril. He
> also
> > > told
> > > > > them that the menace they had
> been
> > > > > > formed to defeat was on the
> same
> > > > > plane they were. Before more
> could
> > > be
> > > > > > revealed, Erebus appeared to
> > > shrivel
> > > > > up and implode into a pile of
> > > > > > leaves. Those leaves then
> formed
> > > > > into the visage of the god
> Fenrys,
> > > who
> > > > > > seized Kage, removing his
> powers
> > > as a
> > > > > cleric, and restoring him to a
> > > > > > druid.
> > > > > > Somewhat startled, the
> party
> > > > > decided to continue on their
> way to
> > > the
> > > > > > ilithid camp, hoping to learn
> more
> > > > > about how to reach the surface,
> as
> > > > > > well as information on Lo
> Pan, who
> > > > > appeared to be worshipped on
> this
> > > > > > world as a deity. Elizabeth
> had
> > > > > found some charts and notes in
> the
> > > > > > captain's cabin on board the
> ship
> > > the
> > > > > Sigil had used when they first
> > > > > > appeared on this world, which
> > > > > suggested that the people on the
> > > ship
> > > > > had
> > > > > > also been followers of Lo Pan.
> > > > > Deciding he was the menace the
> > > group had
> > > > > > been created to destroy, they
> > > needed
> > > > > to learn all they could about
> him.
> > > > > > The group continued
> through
> > > the
> > > > > caverns, until they reached a
> side
> > > > > > cavern. Tori, Neiris and Kage
> > > > > decided to quickly scout it out,
> > > while
> > > > > > the others continued. They
> found
> > > a
> > > > > series of rooms, connected
> > > > > > vertically by holes in the
> floors
> > > and
> > > > > ceilings. Kage explored them,
> > > > > > only to encounter a beholder.
> > > > > Fleeing, he engaged some of the
> > > > > > beholder's minions in combat,
> and
> > > he
> > > > > managed to defeat them, with the
> > > > > > help of Tori and Neiris.
> Soon the
> > > > > party was reunited.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I don't know that
> discussing
> > > last
> > > > > night in great detail is
> > > > > > necessary, or that anyone
> really
> > > > > wants to. In my opinion, it was
> > > > > > certainly the worst night we
> have
> > > had
> > > > > since we started playing the
> Sigil
> > > > > > again, and possibly the worst
> > > night
> > > > > we have ever had playing the
> Sigil
> > > > > > (and I'm not exaggerating).
> For
> > > me,
> > > > > it boils down to one sentence; I
> > > > > > could have not shown up last
> > > night,
> > > > > and it would have made no
> > > > > > difference. I tried to role-
> play
> > > > > with the group, and was totally
> > > > > > ignored (except for Bobby;
> thank
> > > you
> > > > > for role-playing with me), and
> of
> > > > > > course, I sat and did nothing
> for
> > > the
> > > > > final 70 minutes, while everyone
> > > > > > else fought the beholder's
> > > minions.
> > > > > > To be fair, Matt and Damon
> > > > > weren't feeling well. But it
> was a
> > > > > > depressing night for me. I
> was
> > > in a
> > > > > great mood all day long, so it
> was
> > > > > > quite a letdown for me.
> > > > > > If anyone wishes to
> discuss
> > > last
> > > > > night, please let me know.
> > > > > > Otherwise, I'm going to leave
> it
> > > > > at, "It sucked", and walk away.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> >
> >
> >
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