[dungeoncrawl] Re: Thursday Morning Review

  • From: Damon Kline <damon.kline@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • To: "'dungeoncrawl@xxxxxxxxxxxxx'" <dungeoncrawl@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2002 16:11:39 -0400

By that same token, I'm going to apply that theology to the Sigil.  Not that
I'm going to rush them along, but I want to play it somewhat fast paced to
add to the sense of tension.

Once they figure out where they are and what they need to do, I think the
tension will present itself, but I'll hope to add to it with the pace of the
game.


-----Original Message-----
From: Johnathan Detrick [mailto:jdetrick@xxxxxxxxxxx] 
Sent: Thursday, September 05, 2002 4:09 PM
To: dungeoncrawl@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [dungeoncrawl] Re: Thursday Morning Review


    I tend to agree with Damon.  I think, by limiting our time with these
groups, it may actually heighten tension and drama.

Damon Kline wrote:

> In my opinion, I think that is the better option.  I think we need to
limit
> the amount of time we spend on these adventures.  We have already decided
> that we are going to get to a new campaign and start fresh.  In order to
do
> that, we need to clear the table of the existing campaigns.  Right now,
> those are The Sigil, The Riders and The Mini-Riders.  Technically we
started
> the Chosen again for nights that you weren't around due to volunteering,
but
> we can still keep them for occasions when we can't reschedule for some
> reason.
>
> If you can clear off the Riders and the Mini-Riders in the next few
months,
> then I can finish off the Sigil after that.  At that point, we will have
no
> campaigns on our plate and we can start fresh.
>
> I think that in the end, it will make things much easier for us and much
> more enjoyable.
>
> Plus, I kind of like the idea of a mad dash towards the goal!
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: jimkaren@xxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jimkaren@xxxxxxxxxxxx]
> Sent: Thursday, September 05, 2002 11:38 AM
> To: dungeoncrawl@xxxxxxxxxxxxx; dungeoncrawl@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: [dungeoncrawl] Re: Thursday Morning Review
>
> No - I think my plot is taking on a
> life of its own.  It could just as
> easily work as a more straightforward,
> but far more dangerous, race to the
> finish.  Is that the better option
> here?  This is pretty much still in my
> head - let me know what the group
> consensus is!
>
> >
> >     Hmm.  While everything sounds
> exciting, I thought that we had agreed
> > to put the Riders on the back burner
> and just do them for a few months.
> > I thought we were going to run a
> shorter plot for them, and then just do
> > short "movies" for them after that?
> I can't say that I'm real
> > interested in a prolonged Riders
> campaign.  Am I confused?  Did I
> > misunderstand what we talked about
> before?
> >
> > jimkaren@xxxxxxxxxxxx wrote:
> >
> > > Hmm.  Good question!  It's going to
> > > take a while.
> > >
> > > For starters, the low-level guys
> have
> > > to complete their quest for Sonya's
> > > soul.  That will take 1-2 sessions
> for
> > > the current leg (possibly an extra
> > > one).
> > >
> > > Then there will be 1-3 sessions for
> the
> > > next leg of that mission.
> > >
> > > After, they're looking at Sinjen's
> > > situation, I presume.  That's hard
> to
> > > predict right now - it depends on
> what
> > > they do.  To be safe, figure 4
> weeks.
> > >
> > > And then there's Ilana and Kilian.
> Not
> > > so easy to predict - future more
> > > cloudy, it is.
> > >
> > > All together, if we just did that
> > > group, we'd have plenty to play with
> > > until Christmas.
> > >
> > > By the way, John - is it a safe
> > > assumption that Magnus will stop
> > > copying spells for Master Lothar?
> > >
> > > OK, the other groups.  We have no
> > > active plans to DM Marnie's inquest
> for
> > > now, but that may change - fast -
> > > depending on Keith's availability.
> And
> > > we'd also deal at that time with
> Zann,
> > > or whoever Keith may be interested
> in
> > > using at the time.
> > >
> > > The "higher powered" group could
> take a
> > > couple of directions.  If they
> decide
> > > to track down Celane, it could take
> > > several weeks.  If they decide to
> try
> > > to locate the world on their own, it
> > > could also take a while.  They
> could of
> > > course try other options - hunting
> down
> > > the Black Legion, or learning more
> > > about Dr. Klaw, for example.  I'd
> give
> > > the whole shebang at least several
> > > months to finish.
> > >
> > > All told, I could easily keep DMing
> > > until at least next summer -
> > >
> > > > I am honestly looking forward to
> it.
> > > I do have one question though.  Do
> you
> > > > have any idea how long it will
> take
> > > you to get both of these groups to a
> > > > point where you would consider
> > > them "finished"?
> > > >
> > > > I am just curious, because I would
> > > like to know how much time I have
> until
> > > I
> > > > start DMing the Sigil to their
> > > conclusion.  Also, has anyone
> thought
> > > anymore
> > > > on what we are going to do once
> the
> > > Sigil is completed?  I know we won't
> > > > really need to decide that until
> we
> > > get there, but assuming that Jim
> DM's
> > > > for a few more months and then I
> DM
> > > the Sigil to their conclusion, I
> foresee
> > > > them ending sometime before the
> end
> > > of the year next year.  Possibly
> around
> > > > this time frame.  So, we most
> likely
> > > have a year to decide what we want
> to
> > > > do, but I was just curious if
> anyone
> > > had any ideas.  Especially with the
> > > > idea that some of the Riders
> might be
> > > deities by that point, we could even
> > > > play around with the new world.
> > > >
> > > > Anyway, I wanted to get a heads up
> > > from you Jim, just so I can continue
> > > > planning with a time frame in
> mind of
> > > when I'll need to be ready by.
> > > >
> > > > I can't wait to play either of the
> > > groups together again.  The mini-
> riders
> > > > have an interesting mix of
> characters
> > > and personalities that makes them
> very
> > > > fun to play.  The riders are
> always
> > > interesting, especially because
> they can
> > > > kick some major tuckus and they
> will
> > > have to if they want to make it to
> the
> > > > prize.
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: jimkaren@xxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > [mailto:jimkaren@xxxxxxxxxxxx]
> > > > Sent: Thursday, September 05, 2002
> > > 10:17 AM
> > > > To: dungeoncrawl@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > > Subject: [dungeoncrawl] Re:
> Thursday
> > > Morning Review
> > > >
> > > > Yes, next week should definitely
> be
> > > > more action-oriented.  I'd really
> > > like
> > > > to continue the adventure to help
> > > Sonya
> > > > find her soul.  When that is done,
> > > the
> > > > group will be heading back to the
> > > Green
> > > > Mill - an excellent time to
> > > springboard
> > > > to the other group if we want to.
> > > That
> > > > might be at the end of next week,
> but
> > > > the following week at the latest.
> > > >
> > > > > Okay, I'm back!  I missed the
> > > > beginning of the conversation,
> but I
> > > can
> > > > > participate now.  I echo John's
> > > > sentiments about the individual
> role
> > > > > playing.  It does tend to take
> away
> > > > from the momentum of the night and
> > > from
> > > > > the mood that is set.  If two
> > > people
> > > > aren't into the game, then they
> can't
> > > > > help establish the mood and end
> up
> > > > detracting from it.
> > > > >
> > > > > I did enjoy watching Mylena go
> > > around
> > > > and collect the Riders though.
> It was
> > > > > fun to watch and Jim did a great
> > > job
> > > > of making it entertaining.  I
> would
> > > say
> > > > > that it would have been more
> fun to
> > > > get to play the characters
> together.
> > > > > Certainly that is more fun than
> > > > watching other people role-play
> for
> > > long
> > > > > periods of time.
> > > > >
> > > > > I can also say that over the
> past
> > > two
> > > > weeks my enthusiasm has lessened,
> > > > > simply because we didn't really
> get
> > > > much of a chance to work with the
> > > > > characters together as a
> group.  We
> > > > are still getting things "set up"
> and
> > > > > the set up stage is the most
> > > tedious
> > > > and least exciting from a group
> > > dynamic
> > > > > standpoint.  But, I look
> forward to
> > > > the next few weeks as we get to
> see
> > > the
> > > > > groups in action.
> > > > >
> > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > From: Johnathan Detrick
> > > > [mailto:jdetrick@xxxxxxxxxxx]
> > > > > Sent: Thursday, September 05,
> 2002
> > > > 1:21 PM
> > > > > To: dungeoncrawl@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > > > Subject: [dungeoncrawl] Re:
> > > Thursday
> > > > Morning Review
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >     You have certainly given her
> > > tons
> > > > of style.  I'm interested to see
> > > > > her in action with the Riders.
> > > > >
> > > > > jimkaren@xxxxxxxxxxxx wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > I have to say also that I
> really
> > > > had no
> > > > > > idea if Mylena was going to
> > > > succeed -
> > > > > > especially at the end.  All
> of my
> > > > > > expectations had Rig doing
> all of
> > > > the
> > > > > > work, and her doing the
> > > > transportation
> > > > > > afterwards.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > She could have easily been
> killed
> > > by
> > > > > > Baish, if things had gone
> > > > differently,
> > > > > > or especially by Nadan.
> Gadget
> > > > never
> > > > > > got the chance, and I was
> really
> > > > > > relieved that he didn't.  I
> don't
> > > > even
> > > > > > want to think about it if
> Marnie
> > > and
> > > > > > Escrima weren't my own
> characters
> > > > near
> > > > > > the end there.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On a personal note, my
> favorite
> > > > moment
> > > > > > (one of them, anyway), was
> when
> > > > Nadan
> > > > > > made a very real threat to
> finish
> > > > her
> > > > > > off and she said "Hold on a
> > > minute,
> > > > I'm
> > > > > > thinking."  Very Swordfish, if
> > > you
> > > > ask
> > > > > > me!
> > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >     Oh thank God!  I feel so
> > > much
> > > > > > better!  I wanted to make
> sure you
> > > > > > > understand that I truly
> respect
> > > > your
> > > > > > skills as a DM, but I did
> want to
> > > > > > > make my feelings known.
> > > > > > >     I thought that Mylena
> > > > returning
> > > > > > was you trying to get us to
> do it
> > > > > > > ourselves, and I almost did.
> > > > > > However, Magnus had used
> Mylena
> > > in
> > > > the
> > > > > > > first place just so he
> didn't
> > > > have to
> > > > > > do it himself.  He figured,
> if he
> > > > > > > started going after people
> now,
> > > > why
> > > > > > bother to use her at all?
> > > > > > >     Anyway, I already feel
> > > better
> > > > > > about next week.  I'm anxious
> to
> > > > play
> > > > > > > again.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > jimkaren@xxxxxxxxxxxx wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Nah, you're right.  I'm
> really
> > > > > > > > committed to the long-term
> > > > story arc
> > > > > > > > that I envision, but it's
> > > > important
> > > > > > to
> > > > > > > > me that the foundation
> not be
> > > > > > > > undermined to rush to the
> good
> > > > > > stuff.
> > > > > > > > Last night, I went in
> > > assuming
> > > > that
> > > > > > > > after the first two or
> three
> > > > > > characters
> > > > > > > > got free, they'd get
> together
> > > > with
> > > > > > > > Magnus and take care of
> the
> > > > rest on
> > > > > > > > their own (eliminating any
> > > need
> > > > for
> > > > > > > > individual roleplaying).
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > That's one reason why
> Mylena
> > > > came
> > > > > > back
> > > > > > > > partway thru - she thought
> > > that
> > > > the
> > > > > > > > group only needed her to
> get
> > > > them
> > > > > > > > started, and they'd take
> it
> > > from
> > > > > > > > there.  Still, though, it
> was
> > > > > > important
> > > > > > > > to me that the characters
> come
> > > > > > together
> > > > > > > > in a plausible way - after
> > > all,
> > > > they
> > > > > > > > were put on the planes in
> a
> > > > manner
> > > > > > that
> > > > > > > > made it tough to leave,
> and I
> > > > didn't
> > > > > > > > want to make that seem
> like a
> > > > > > trivial
> > > > > > > > limitation.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > I don't foresee any need
> for
> > > > nights
> > > > > > > > like the last few down the
> > > > road -
> > > > > > > > actually, if it does
> happen,
> > > > I'll be
> > > > > > > > banging my head on the
> wall
> > > to
> > > > keep
> > > > > > > > things moving - but it
> does
> > > seem
> > > > > > like
> > > > > > > > it's becoming the norm.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > I guess the stakes are so
> > > high
> > > > in
> > > > > > what
> > > > > > > > we're doing with
> > > the "powerful"
> > > > > > group,
> > > > > > > > that I want to make sure
> the
> > > > group
> > > > > > > > earns their victory -
> warts
> > > and
> > > > all.
> > > > > > > > The last thing we need is
> for
> > > > the
> > > > > > > > characters to easily
> obtain
> > > > godhood,
> > > > > > > > and then for us as
> players to
> > > > find
> > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > whole thing so
> unsatisfying
> > > > that we
> > > > > > > > look for ways to make them
> > > > mortal
> > > > > > again.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Definitely open to
> > > suggestions -
> > > >  I'm
> > > > > > > > actually planning on
> emailing
> > > > Shawn
> > > > > > B.
> > > > > > > > soon (hee hee) to get guru
> > > level
> > > > > > advice
> > > > > > > > on my long term plans, but
> > > it's
> > > > > > > > important most of all that
> > > > everyone
> > > > > > is
> > > > > > > > having fun when we get
> > > > together -
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >     Ok, I'm going to
> start
> > > by
> > > > > > being
> > > > > > > > honest.  I have been
> debating
> > > > how to
> > > > > > > > > respond to Jim's e-mail,
> > > > which may
> > > > > > > > seem odd, since I am the
> cold
> > > > > > hearted
> > > > > > > > > bastard of the group
> and I
> > > > usually
> > > > > > > > have no problem being
> > > honest.
> > > > My
> > > > > > > > > concern is that I know
> that
> > > > Jim
> > > > > > is a
> > > > > > > > superior DM, and I don't
> want
> > > > this
> > > > > > > > > taken the wrong way.
> That
> > > > being
> > > > > > > > said, I didn't enjoy last
> > > night
> > > > as
> > > > > > much
> > > > > > > > > as I had hoped to.
> > > > > > > > >     I think the thing
> that
> > > > really
> > > > > > > > killed me was the second
> week
> > > > in a
> > > > > > row
> > > > > > > > > of individual role-
> > > playing.
> > > > It
> > > > > > seems
> > > > > > > > to be a common thread for
> us,
> > > > and
> > > > > > > > > I'm not sure how we
> became
> > > > caught
> > > > > > in
> > > > > > > > the trap.  Three weeks
> ago,
> > > > before
> > > > > > > > > the Riders fought Rig,
> Jim
> > > had
> > > > > > > > brought the subject up
> with
> > > > me.  I
> > > > > > had
> > > > > > > > > advised against it.  He
> > > > decided
> > > > > > to do
> > > > > > > > it anyway, and he did some
> > > > > > > > > individual role-playing
> with
> > > > > > Ilana,
> > > > > > > > Kilian, Valeria and the
> > > group.
> > > > And
> > > > > > > > > it went very well.  Jim
> > > jumped
> > > > > > from
> > > > > > > > one player to another and
> > > kept
> > > > the
> > > > > > > > > sessions short.  He had
> > > > proved me
> > > > > > > > wrong; individual role-
> > > playing
> > > > can
> > > > > > > > > work, and he went on to
> DM
> > > > one of
> > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > best nights of D&D we have
> > > had
> > > > in
> > > > > > > > > a long time.  He also
> left
> > > me
> > > > > > feeling
> > > > > > > > incredibly positive and
> > > excited
> > > > > > > > > about the future.  I
> > > believe,
> > > > if
> > > > > > Jim
> > > > > > > > had suggested it, I would
> have
> > > > > > > > > called off work, and
> told
> > > > Brad I
> > > > > > > > wasn't coming home, and
> then
> > > > > > barricaded
> > > > > > > > > myself in the basement
> for
> > > the
> > > > > > next
> > > > > > > > three weeks straight to
> see
> > > > what Jim
> > > > > > > > > had planned.
> > > > > > > > >     Then last week
> > > happened.
> > > > We
> > > > > > did
> > > > > > > > almost all individual
> role-
> > > > playing,
> > > > > > > > > and it caused the night
> to
> > > > slow
> > > > > > > > down.  I know that when I
> > > left
> > > > last
> > > > > > > > > week, my enthusiasm had
> > > > dimmed a
> > > > > > > > little, but I was still
> > > excited.
> > > > > > > > > Unfortunately, last
> night
> > > was
> > > > > > more of
> > > > > > > > the same.  I had hoped
> that
> > > Jim
> > > > > > > > > would quickly gather the
> > > party
> > > > > > and we
> > > > > > > > could be off.  Instead,
> each
> > > > > > > > > individual character was
> > > > gathered.
> > > > > > > > It took almost all night.
> > > And
> > > > I'm
> > > > > > > > > afraid it drained my
> > > > enthusiasm
> > > > > > even
> > > > > > > > more.
> > > > > > > > >     I'm still looking
> > > forward
> > > > to
> > > > > > > > where Jim is going with
> this
> > > > plot.
> > > > > > As
> > > > > > > > > we saw three weeks ago,
> he
> > > > can DM
> > > > > > an
> > > > > > > > adventure better than
> most,
> > > and
> > > > > > > > > deliver us a great
> night of
> > > > role-
> > > > > > > > playing.  But I fear that
> the
> > > > last
> > > > > > two
> > > > > > > > > weeks have leeched some
> of
> > > the
> > > > > > > > momentum he had going.
> It's
> > > > going
> > > > > > to be
> > > > > > > > > more work on everyone's
> > > part
> > > > to
> > > > > > get
> > > > > > > > us back to the fever
> pitch we
> > > > were
> > > > > > > > > in a few weeks ago.
> > > > > > > > >     Comments?  Please?
> I
> > > > don't
> > > > > > > > intend to be overly
> critical
> > > of
> > > > > > Jim.  I
> > > > > > > > > know how hard it can be
> to
> > > DM
> > > > (I
> > > > > > am
> > > > > > > > the person that has had
> more
> > > > than
> > > > > > > > > one campaign that I put
> a
> > > lot
> > > > of
> > > > > > work
> > > > > > > > into shot out from under
> me
> > > when
> > > > > > > > > the players said that
> they
> > > > weren't
> > > > > > > > interested), and I know
> Jim
> > > can
> > > > pull
> > > > > > > > > it together.  But the
> last
> > > few
> > > > > > weeks
> > > > > > > > just haven't worked for
> me.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > jimkaren@xxxxxxxxxxxx
> wrote:
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > I don't know about
> > > everyone
> > > > > > else,
> > > > > > > > but I
> > > > > > > > > > had a good time last
> > > > night!  It
> > > > > > was
> > > > > > > > an
> > > > > > > > > > odd night, in a way,
> as
> > > > only one
> > > > > > > > player
> > > > > > > > > > was doing anything at
> any
> > > > given
> > > > > > time
> > > > > > > > > > for most of it.  I
> didn't
> > > > intend
> > > > > > > > that
> > > > > > > > > > at first, but somehow
> it
> > > > worked.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > The gist was Magnus
> sent
> > > > > > Mylena, his
> > > > > > > > > > alternate-reality
> daughter
> > > > > > (believe
> > > > > > > > it
> > > > > > > > > > or not, it all makes
> > > sense
> > > > from
> > > > > > a
> > > > > > > > > > campaign perspective)
> > > > > > to "capture"
> > > > > > > > > > certain Riders who
> were
> > > > > > imprisoned
> > > > > > > > on
> > > > > > > > > > the outer planes.  If
> > > they
> > > > left
> > > > > > of
> > > > > > > > > > their own free will,
> or
> > > > > > knowingly,
> > > > > > > > > > there was a greater
> > > chance
> > > > of
> > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > gods
> > > > > > > > > > becoming offended or
> > > > realizing
> > > > > > what
> > > > > > > > was
> > > > > > > > > > happening.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > And since the gods
> have no
> > > > > > > > influence in
> > > > > > > > > > the city of Sigil, and
> > > since
> > > > > > Mylena
> > > > > > > > > > technically never
> existed
> > > in
> > > > > > these
> > > > > > > > > > characters' version of
> > > > > > > > the "realms", it
> > > > > > > > > > seemed plausible that
> her
> > > > > > activities
> > > > > > > > > > could go unnoticed
> for a
> > > > period
> > > > > > of
> > > > > > > > time.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > In the end, Mylena
> > > > succeeded in
> > > > > > > > > > capturing most of the
> > > Riders
> > > > > > she was
> > > > > > > > > > sent for after a very
> > > > difficult
> > > > > > > > > > struggle.  She
> exhausted
> > > > Rig,
> > > > > > my now
> > > > > > > > > > very-deceased evil
> 17th
> > > > level
> > > > > > > > > > gladiator, five
> powerful
> > > > > > mercenary
> > > > > > > > > > githyanki, and almost
> > > > herself
> > > > > > to do
> > > > > > > > > > it.  She used sheer
> power,
> > > > > > > > treachery,
> > > > > > > > > > luck, or whatever it
> > > would
> > > > take
> > > > > > to
> > > > > > > > pull
> > > > > > > > > > it off, and it was
> fun to
> > > > see in
> > > > > > > > action
> > > > > > > > > > since I didn't have a
> > > > definite
> > > > > > > > outcome
> > > > > > > > > > in mind.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > I thought about
> forcing
> > > > > > characters
> > > > > > > > to
> > > > > > > > > > be captured last
> night,
> > > but
> > > > in
> > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > end,
> > > > > > > > > > I would be helping the
> > > > Riders to
> > > > > > > > win.
> > > > > > > > > > And that wouldn't be
> > > fair.
> > > > It
> > > > > > may
> > > > > > > > > > sound like a "yeah
> sure"
> > > > thing,
> > > > > > but
> > > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > group's rivals (like
> > > > Celane, the
> > > > > > > > Black
> > > > > > > > > > Legion, and maybe Dr.
> > > Klaw)
> > > > all
> > > > > > > > have a
> > > > > > > > > > chance to succeed.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > So the Riders ended up
> > > > > > prisoners of
> > > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > Dustmen faction in
> Sigil's
> > > > > > Mortuary
> > > > > > > > (as
> > > > > > > > > > Mylena is a member
> there -
> > > > > > > > apparently,
> > > > > > > > > > she's at least partly
> a
> > > > > > > > necromancer).
> > > > > > > > > > They were released
> > > > > > simultaneously
> > > > > > > > from
> > > > > > > > > > gas-filled iron
> caskets,
> > > and
> > > > > > > > proceeded
> > > > > > > > > > to deal with their
> > > > situation.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > In the end, Magnus
> got a
> > > > core
> > > > > > group
> > > > > > > > to
> > > > > > > > > > agree to his crusade.
> > > Some
> > > > > > other
> > > > > > > > > > characters offered to
> help
> > > > > > Marnie
> > > > > > > > (my
> > > > > > > > > > swashbuckler) search
> for
> > > her
> > > > > > > > husband,
> > > > > > > > > > Surrote, who had gone
> > > > missing
> > > > > > on his
> > > > > > > > > > own and couldn't be
> > > located
> > > > by
> > > > > > > > Mylena.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Ambrosia preferred to
> > > remain
> > > > > > > > retired,
> > > > > > > > > > running her new inn,
> and
> > > > > > the "lower
> > > > > > > > > > level" riders that we
> > > used
> > > > last
> > > > > > week
> > > > > > > > > > are still doing their
> own
> > > > thing.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > And that is where we
> > > ended.
> > > > > > > > > > Thoughts/comments?
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> >
> >
> >




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