[dance-tech] Re: thematic discussions on contemporary dance, media and technology?

From: Johannes Birringer <Johannes.Birringer@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: "dance-tech@xxxxxxxxxxxxx" <dance-tech@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2015 18:03:09 +0000
Dear all, dear Sabine and Kamma

thanks for the replies, and yes Sabine I believe I was well aware that you had 
taken on the moderator role of the List [MEDIA-ARTS-AND-DANCE@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx] 
some while ago, and acknowledged that in my short look back; having been a 
subscriber to this list, and a moderator of the dance--tech list, I tend to 
save all postings and keep records and try and follow. I hope you did not mind 
me
asking here, in the public, whether members of the list feel an interest in a 
public discussion of some theme. I have not seen a discussion in quite some 
time,
and you are suggesting that discussions are "taken off the group"  -- not sure 
that I understand that, you mean a comment or an announcement leads to a 
further private
correspondence?  But that is not what I meant, I was proposing to ask whether 
such a maillist as ours can be/ or can be recreated to be / a forum.

And following Kamm's remark, yes, announcements are great, and some are of 
interest to pursue further, but if they are local conferences, film festivals, 
premieres, or workshops,
they will address the local audiences (and those who, if known well enough in 
advance, can travel there) in the vicinity, not an international maillist that 
could function as an
experimental thinking space and a place where knowledge and experience can be 
exchanged.

with regards
Johannes Birringer


>>
Hi all
I pass on the info from this list like calls, to the Danish screendance 
community and me and Maia Sørensen  post relevant stuff on 
our/Dansehallernes/ScreenMoves´ facebook page: 
https://www.facebook.com/ScreenMoves?fref=ts

However receiving notice of some 3 hour session happening tomorrow in a 
different country is not of much use. And sometimes there are more 
promotional-like mails where you have to look

 for the digital/screen component of some dance company, the main part being 
their regular PR info , - in another country, soon, again this is not of so 
much use.

Best regards
Kamma

Kamma Siegumfeldt
Info/communication, project manager keðja
+45 33 88 80 21 ksi@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:ksi@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
www.kedja.net<http://www.kedja.net/>   
www.facebook.com/kedja2012<http://www.facebook.com/kedja2012>

>>



Fra: Media Arts and Dance [mailto:MEDIA-ARTS-AND-DANCE@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx] På vegne 
af S Klaus-Carter
Sendt: 5. marts 2015 10:37
Til: 
MEDIA-ARTS-AND-DANCE@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:MEDIA-ARTS-AND-DANCE@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Emne: Re: thematic discussions on contemporary dance (media and technology)?

Dear Johannes,

Many thanks for bringing this up.

Dear All,

I am the current moderator...the interest and feedback I have received since 
taking over has only been positive. People feel that they can share very 
directly through it and be part of a community, even if not everything is of 
direct interest to them. Personally I see the mailing list as a nice 
complementation to other sources like Dance-Tech.net. I always read our threads 
as well as Dance Tech's and similar email shots with a lot of interest and feel 
kept in the loop and inspired by them.

From my experience, some or even most discussions get "taken off" the group and 
directly discussed by the inital sender and the person who is interested. I 
know that some project collaborations happened directly through this.

Looking forward to further feedback,

Sabine Klaus-Carter
Mailing List Moderator
Creation Editor Ltd
www.creationeditor.co.uk<http://www.creationeditor.co.uk>


> Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2015 13:46:14 +0000
> From: Johannes.Birringer@xxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:Johannes.Birringer@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Subject: Re: thematic discussions on contemporary dance (media and 
> technology)?
> To: 
> MEDIA-ARTS-AND-DANCE@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:MEDIA-ARTS-AND-DANCE@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>
>
> dear all
>
> during a recent online discussion on "New Tools and Technologies", the 
> original initiator of the empyre maillist, Melinda Rackham, mentioned how she 
> introduced empyre soft_skinned space to a like-minded group of people 
> interested in networked culture back in 2002. "Empyre forum emerged as part 
> of my phd research, when in January 2002 I invited artists, poets, 
> videographers, bloggers, roboticist, thinkers, tinkers, technicians, writers, 
> curators and cultural workers from around the world who had some interest in 
> the construction of virtual realities, to participate in open non competitive 
> discussion of where their thinking or projects were at. It was never intended 
> to be an academic forum, but a wide community platform where many voices and 
> perspectives had equal weight."
>
> A debate followed on how women use tools and how maillists may have been 
> superseded by newer social media platforms etc); Randall Packer wondered 
> aloud "that text-only mailing list forums are still the most vital and 
> dynamic space for dialogue, even though the Internet and the Web have 
> advanced dramatically since the 1990s and early 2000s. I am not sure if it is 
> the medium that is the problem, but rather the intent. The intense focus and 
> seriousness of debate found in mailing list forums are simply not the purpose 
> of social media, which reaches out to a broader audience and thus a more 
> heterogenous group....". Melinda then commented: "So tools and technologies 
> don't need to be new, specialised, expensive or complex, and often the more 
> straight fwd the longer lasting and more far reaching their outcomes. That’s 
> why I used the rather daggy list serv format for -empyre- with plain text 
> messages. It was, and still is, easy to use, easy to contain, easy to search, 
> and has no distractions. In 2002 I was hoping ---empyre- would a space were 
> it was safe to make propositions which left one a little giddy or vulnerable 
> - but I guess the reality is text based interaction becomes performative in a 
> knowledge based economy and status anxiety precludes these sorts of risks."
>
> To conclude, Melinda also said she left the list at some point, and "the 
> community itself took over as the holder of the common space," and then the 
> discussion focussed on archived history of debates in such common space.
>
> This all made me want to invite you to respond to the question of whether 
> this list community still uses 
> MEDIA-ARTS-AND-DANCE@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:MEDIA-ARTS-AND-DANCE@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>  for discussion and debate, sees any reason for it to exist, or wonders about 
> its history and thus the traditions of themed debates, threads, and 
> controversies we enjoyed on the dance-tech lists and on this one a while back?
>
> When http://www.dance-tech.net/ was created by Marlon Barrios Solano, it was 
> so rich and became popular so quickly, that 
> dance-tech@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:dance-tech@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> as well as 
> MEDIA-ARTS-AND-DANCE@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:MEDIA-ARTS-AND-DANCE@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>  seemed to fade a bit. Please correct me if you feel it has continued to 
> provide valuable information about cine-danse festivals, premieres, and so 
> on, and thus was very very helpful.
>
> Yet dance-tech@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:dance-tech@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> is turning 10 
> years old, this year, and actually can look back to an even longer history. 
> We've also, since December 2006/early 2007, been allied with 
> MEDIA-ARTS-AND-DANCE@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:MEDIA-ARTS-AND-DANCE@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
>  founded in December 2006 by Simon Fildes; subsequently moderated by Sabine 
> Klaus.
>
>
> so I wanted to ask how subscribers feel about their list, and whether a need 
> of discussion and dialogue exists or could be rekindled.
>
> Please post your view here, if you have a moment, and suggest topics for 
> discussion..
>
> regards
> Johannes Birringer
> dap-lab
> http://www.brunel.ac.uk/dap
> -----------------------------
> PS
> brief lookback
>
> For those not already familiar with some of our histories, let me add that we 
> do have archives, and repertoires:
>
>
> (a) prehistories (emergence of internet, early chatrooms, MUDs, MOOs, WELL, 
> ArtsWire, Crossfade, rhizome, etc & the AIDS quilt/Online Against AIDS, early 
> 1990s) were re-evoked during an intensely live debate on "art history online" 
> in the fall of 2013 (Crumb list on new media curating).
>
> (b) dance-tech
>
> It would be good to hear more of you reflect on your involvement in communal 
> actions and developments in the wider, international dance-tech movement, 
> especially if you joined recently and if "dance-tech" may well be antiquated 
> term, not reflecting your network or collaborative work Rather than 
> mentioning Mailing Lists I joined later, I wish to briefly recount the dance 
> and performance network that interested me and that evolved in the early to 
> mid-1990s, an international network built and sustained through efforts of 
> persons, visionaries, go-getters, people-connectors, and these persons and 
> efforts brought many of us together in workshops, and some festivals 
> organized around the emerging dance & technology field.
>
> The f2f work was complemented by Maillists and online discussions that were 
> then set up and enabled, and I very briefly chronicle the stages:
>
> (1) D&TZ [Dance & Technology Zone] and DTZ Mailing List
>
> Since early 1995, Ohio State University hosted a Dance and Technology list 
> server that has served to bridge the geographic gap between those working 
> with dance and technology worldwide. With over 500 choreographers, dancers, 
> technologists and theorists subscribed to the list, it became become a lively 
> hub of discussion about issues regarding the integration of media and live 
> performance. A Hyper-archive of all of the discussions that have taken place 
> on the Dance & Technology List since September 1996 has been created: For 
> each year, you may view the archive by thread, subject, author or date. 
> http://art.net/~dtz/mailarchive.html
>
> Important initiators and go-getters: - Creation and maintenance of this site 
> was the result of an ongoing collaborative project of Troika Ranch (New York) 
> and Writing Research Associates / Scott deLahunta (Amsterdam, back then, now 
> Scott is with MotionBank/Forsythe Company), later aided by OSU (Scott 
> Sutherland, David Ralley). I think joined the Maillist in 1997. Like 
> “Crossfade”, The Dance & Technology Zone (D&TZ) defined itself as a resource 
> for artists and others who are particularly interested in using new media and 
> information technologies in the creation and performance of dance, dance 
> theater and related live performance works.
>
>
> (2) The D&TZ List faded in 2004 or thereabouts, after the IDAT festivals 
> organized in different places over the years seemed to have become more 
> difficult to host Arizona State University,in 1999 was the 4th and last one). 
> Since 2000, the most important platform had taken place at the Monaco Dance 
> Forum which took the lead in organizing biannual events (2000, 2002, 2004, 
> 2006) featuring new digital performances and installations, along with 
> artists workshops on new technologies. In 2006, curator Philippe Baudelot 
> announced that the Dance Forum would from now on no longer present specific 
> technologies as tools at the service of artists in order not to question the 
> artists’ subject matter with respect to tools. Technology had become second 
> nature, and Baudelot now wanted to emphasize the artistic dimensions of new 
> choreography. There were other pioneering workshops, festivals, and 
> production platforms. These need to be honored as well and mentioned as we 
> expand the history writing.
>
>
> Working in England at the time (and having learnt of Ghislaine Boddington's 
> pioneering work and that of others), I hosted "Digital Cultures" in 
> Nottingham in 2005 [http://www.digitalcultures.org/], and Mark Coniglio 
> (Troika Ranch) and I started the new Dance-Tech Maillist 
> (dance-tech@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:dance-tech@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>) > 
> //www.freelists.org/webpage/dance-tech. "A list for those interested in 
> combining dance and new computer technology, including responsive systems 
> that allow performers to manipulate digital media in real time, interactive 
> digital scenography, and motion capture, as well as the development of new 
> software and hardware tools for choreographers and dancers."
>
> Archive: //www.freelists.org/archive/dance-tech
>
> (3) Since 2009, members and the expanding family have migrated to: 
> http://www.dance-tech.net/
>
> The Dance Tech Social Network | Innovation in Motion….Platform [now called: 
> The Social Network for Innovators in Motion] is a much larger and complex 
> operation (initiated and curated by Marlon Barrios Solano), driven by 
> hundreds and hundreds, yes, thousands, of members who post videos and 
> contribute to forum discussions, workshops, publications, interviews, etc. 
> Some live stream channels (linked to the new Meta-Academy that is being 
> developed by us) have been added and the live and archived productions are 
> increasing steadily.
>
> (4) Adjacent lists: 
> MEDIA-ARTS-AND-DANCE@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:MEDIA-ARTS-AND-DANCE@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>  (initiated in December 2006 by Simon Fildes; currently moderated by Sabine 
> Klaus).
>
> (5) I also launched a smaller one in Germany called "Tanzforschung": 
> tanzforschung@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:tanzforschung@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>, which 
> has declined and is rarely alive.
>
> (6) There must have been other dance /dancemedia lists in other countries 
> (Japan, Korea, and the South American continent, Southwest Europe and the 
> former East), and if you have information pleas share
>
> (7) Telematic Dance: in 2000 ADaPT was founded and we began to work on 
> telematic dance projects for a number of years via our own maillist 
> [PacketWranglers@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] for the express purpose of communicating on 
> matters of telematic performance, technical and conceptual issues and the 
> creative preparations of our joint multi-site productions. That network also 
> grew rapidly.
> the archives are distributed: http://www.dvpg.net/adapt.html; 
> http://www.ephemeral-efforts.com/ADaPT.html ; 
> https://bromberg.dpp.sandbox.lib.utah.edu/related-works/adapt-telepresent-artistic-collaboratories/;
>  etc. The initial élan of ADAPT dissipated around 2010. Such dissolutions 
> also happened to smaller interest groupings or networks operating perhaps 
> less visibly under the radar, such as 
> forum-realtime@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:forum-realtime@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>, 
> KINETICS, PARIP, digitalartsforum.org.uk, 
> newworknetwork@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:newworknetwork@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>.
>
>
> But my question is, do we want to use this list to start some moderated or 
> free-flow discussions on matters that interest us?
[dance-tech] Re: thematic discussions on contemporary dance, media and technology?

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