[cryptome] Re: a few little tidbits to ponder

  • From: Todd Judge <toddbob@xxxxxxx>
  • To: "cryptome@xxxxxxxxxxxxx" <cryptome@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Mon, 06 Oct 2014 10:39:08 +0900

Thanks all,
Thank you all very much for the info and this very good discussion.  I couldn't 
agree more with your insights.

The number one problem:  
I just see the constant cloud over all of this as the complacent general 
public, who won't bother to read up on it, won't bother to understand any of 
it, nor the vast implications of the intrusions, and sit any actions out 
because they "can't do anything about it anyway".  Pedestrians will always just 
accept it.   It is only because mass society's complacency regarding these 
basic human infringements on personal privacy has been around so many decades 
(centuries??) that we find this is the state of our governments' "security" 
endeavors today.  

What can be done?
How does one implicate an effective global wake-up call?  I am admittedly 
"complacent" in my inability to conjure up any tangible answers where I could 
participate.  It makes me feel hypocritical even pondering that question when I 
know my own personal answer is "I haven't the slightest idea".

Thanks again,

On Oct 6, 2014, at 1:20 AM, Shaun O'Connor <capricorn8159@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

Glad you found it absorbing Dougie. Looks like the proverbial could hit the fan 
both sides of the Atlantic once people start putting the pieces of the puzzle 
This just demonstrates what the Church commission where warning about years ago 
and they where rightly concerned at the overreach of the NSA and its cohorts.

Their sheer arrogance will get the better of them in time. that's for sure.
> On 05/10/2014 16:50, doug wrote:
> Hi Shaun,
> One learns something new every day... :-).  Tx for the information...
> Now, that was a very interesting article.  I particularly liked the bit where 
> the NSA went and classified documents which were already in the public domain 
> and were never secret.  How can one do this retroactively, and what do they 
> expect to achieve?  It is like punishing someone for an action in the past 
> which wasn't criminal, or trying to push a baby back into the womb.  They 
> certainly don't like criticism and have become very arrogant, using such 
> threatening tactics to try and scare someone into not carrying out their 
> legal and public duty.
>  I also wondered who this guy Friedman was in the article on Cryptome url:
> 2014-1391.pdf 
>  and why they took his unclassified documents away and then classified them, 
> nice to have that one answered too.  
> Also, the Patriot Act which is allowing the NSA and Homeland Security to 
> operate this mass surveillance of US citizens which has a sunshine clause 
> which ends next year, is forcing them to rethink the Freedom of Information 
> Act is a real belter. 
> Pity about the mass surveillance on non US citizens though.  I suppose other 
> nation states will just have to change their own laws and keep the US out,  
> If they can't get proper accountability       and control, business will lose 
> confidence in secure systems in the USA, develop their own and shift 
> elsewhere.  This interference in people's private affairs, particularly when 
> they use criminal methods, such as compromising computers with malware and 
> viruses and without getting a search warrant (a criminal offence for everyone 
> else) and no one knows how it is being used is going to bring about some 
> major changes in the future.
>    Interesting too, that GCHQ which has always said that it operates under 
> English Law, and therefore has NEVER exchanged information via the backdoor 
> yet here we have exposure of "Project Minaret", which did that very thing. 
> see url: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_MINARET
>  Both countries exchanging information and data on their own citizens via the 
> back door, so that they can't be accused of being criminals.  It is the way 
> that these national intelligence and security changes exchange information 
> about their own citizens, quite willy nilly, without proper consultation or 
> jurisdiction, and then deny that they are doing it that gets me.  What do we 
> pay taxes for, so that they protect us, and our security, not so that they 
> can give away our private data, our financial details via SWIFT etc, without 
> our knowledge or permission.   If they are doing it, and they are doing it 
> legally, why not say so and point ones' nose to the appropriate legal 
> authority.
> The history of denial of criminal activities, only to be found out at a later 
> date has become so noticable, that it is no wonder that more and more of Joe 
> Public is not prepared to trust the words that they, and the politicians 
> utter from their mouths.
> Dougie.
>> On 05/10/14 10:53, Shaun O'Connor wrote:
>> Hello fellow crytomites
>> here are a few links that might be worth looking at
>> the first looks at the very secretive S12333 which the NSA are using in 
>> order to subcert civil privacy in the US and s215 of the Patriot act which , 
>> if this item is correct could expire june next year.
>> -- 
>> http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/oct/04/nsa-surveillance-reform-politicians-2015
>> Next up, A nice little article by James Bamford which includes a 
>> downloadable copy of an original prosicutorial document heavily implicating 
>> the NSA in illegal activities from way back in the 1970's
>> At the time the document was originally drawn up only 2 copies apparently 
>> existed, the justice department had one and Bamford had the other.
>> https://firstlook.org/theintercept/2014/10/02/the-nsa-and-me/
>> Happy reading.
>> ATB
>> Shaun


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