[cryptome] Re: Former Spy Chief Reveals Secret Strategies for Undermining Freedom, Attacking Religion, and Promoting Terrorism

  • From: douglas rankine <douglasrankine2001@xxxxxxxxxxx>
  • To: cryptome@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
  • Date: Tue, 12 Jan 2016 21:54:33 +0000

Hi Michael,
I dunno Mike, but that was the way I interpreted it...:-) . And who is to say that my interpretation is not better than your utterance of it? You don't know who the document was written by...I don't know who the document was written by. The Wikipedia article says it was published by the Russians in 1903. That doesn't mean that it was written by a Russian, could have been an international writer, or by Anonymous. 2nd point. How many different editions of it are there. And are all those editions an exact copy of the "original". What editions were used by foreign publishers, were the Protocols "doctored" by someone, who thought it would fit the times, the philosophy, the purposes of his/her masters; and give it the necessary credibility amongst the chattering classes or the masses? Is the published version the same as what the writer wrote. Also, Wikipedia, is not exactly the most reliable source of information...but a nice starting point...which is why always use it...because I am lazy...:-) . I always go to Wikipedia when I start to study a new subject, one should always research as wide as possible before forming an opinion, in my book. As I say, I could go on.

I am always wary about believing anything which has even a hint of a secret or intelligence service, be it the CIA, GCHQ or the old KGB. or MOSSAD, (to name but a few) for that matter. The Zinoviev letter is a case and point...well worth researching...and reading in conjunction with the fictions of John Le Carre...(not his real name of course)...:-) .I never got as far as the source of the article, or the book. I was just making, what I thought, was a most helpful and constructive observation to the discussion.

Like Shelley, I appreciate, like and enjoy what you are doing...and have followed up, those which are of particular interest, with due diligence, some of the urls which you have been putting on the list. It is quite refreshing to see such work, and we need more of it on this mailing list and in the world.
P.S." a proximate and ultimate cause" is meaningless...it is either absolute and true...or not...and is a contradiction in itself or means whatever you or I want it to mean...:-) . Ultimate is a relation, not an absolute. Judges use that kind of langauge, and the intelligence services use that kind of langauge when they are trying to justify something which can't...I have noticed..:-) .
P.P.S. I reserve the "right" to take apart an article without going to the source. I like to follow other people's example. and there is a lot of them around. It is bad practice I know...but there you are...I never was known for being mainstream, politically correct or following "offical doctrine"...Always got me into trouble.

On 12/01/2016 21:14, Michael Best wrote:

    So...if I distribute something, no matter what it says, and the
    more well known it is, the better...say copy and paste it, and it
    is picked up, copied and acted upon all over the world, then I am
    not responsible and cannot be held responsible for its content or
the actions which result from it.

Is that what I said? Nope. Did I imply that? Nope. I just referred to proximate and ultimate cause. If the document hadn't been forged by the Russians, it wouldn't have been given to John Ford and distributed here and in Nazi Germany.

And going to the sources, does not get one off the hook either.

No, but it's necessary if you're going to try to "take apart" an "article" (I'm not sure if that referred to the list of excerpts or the actual book, with all the context and supporting details and citations).

On Tue, Jan 12, 2016 at 4:08 PM, douglas rankine <douglasrankine2001@xxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:douglasrankine2001@xxxxxxxxxxx>> wrote:

    Hi Michael,
    So...if I distribute something, no matter what it says, and the
    more well known it is, the better...say copy and paste it, and it
    is picked up, copied and acted upon all over the world, then I am
    not responsible and cannot be held responsible for its content or
    the actions which result from it.  And the more widely it is
    known, the more credible it is made, the more true it
    is...Interesting view of free speech...research, truth, lies,
    deception and all that jazz.

And going to the sources, does not get one off the hook either. Consulting the sources does not necessarily establish the truth,
    or remove the disinformation, as I found out when I got to the
    40th volume of Lenin's works, only to find out that they had all
    been "doctored"  i.e. made politically correct to suit comrade
    Stalin's view of the world, by his comrades in the publishing
    house.  It was only later that I realised, as Henry Ford
    said..."History is bunk"...took a lot of convincing...but I admit
    to being a slow learner...:-) .

      I once read a book called "The Meaning of Meaning" which was
written in the late 19th century, by a load of English Academics, after reading it and digesting it for a long time, it made a lot
    of sense to me...It posed the question, and the only answer it
    could give was how difficult it was to establish what the truth
    was or what meaning was...:-) .

    Of course, at some time one has to come down to a point where on
    has to believe in something enough to act on it..and then one
    joins all the other philosophers of the world, in giving one's own
interpretation of what oneself and the world is all about. Difficult proposition, and has little to do with truth.
    In a famous book called "What is History"  E.H. Carr argues that
    history is written by the historians.
    P.S. There are many truths, the science is picking the one you
    want to believe in and putting it into practice.  The art is
    getting as many others to believe in it and you as possible so
    that  you are a success...:-) . Believe and act in the wrong
    things at the wrong time and you are fucked.  c'est la vie...:-) .
    Playing with Goebballs.

    On 12/01/2016 20:44, Michael Best wrote:
    The difference, Dougie, is that one is widely known and the other
    isn't. There's also the fact that the Russians were responsible
    for the forgery, so all distributions of the book can be laid at
    their feet.

    Also, if you want to pick something apart you'd have to resort to
    the source material - not a few dozen quotes from a 450 page
    book. Context, after all, is king (and the extensive notes and
    references help a lot, too)

    On Tue, Jan 12, 2016 at 3:39 PM, douglas rankine
    <mailto:douglasrankine2001@xxxxxxxxxxx>> wrote:

        sWho speaketh the truth?
        Just a squick observation on disinformation below, an example
        of how information on disinformation can be spread
        inadvertently...:-) .

        quote<<<<How the Soviet bloc planted 4,000 agents of
        influence in the Islamic world, armed with hundreds of
        thousands of copies of the most infamous anti-Semitic book in
        history, to fan the flames of ancient Arab resentments
        against the U.S. and Israel and sow the seeds of
        anti-Semitism that would later bloom in the form of violence
        and terror toward Jews and Christians.>>>end of quote.

        According to Wikipedia at url:

         The Soviets were not the only ones to promote the book.

        This book was also promoted by Henry Ford who funded the
        printing of 500,000 copies of it.  Adolf Hitler also had it
        distributed to schools in Germany and its anti-Jewish message
        was taught as a part of the national socialist curriculum.
        I think it also crops up in a book called The Da Vinci Code
        by Dan Brown where he mentions the formation and existence of
        the Priory of Sion.  In the introduction to the Book, Dan
        Brown, says that "everything in this book is true"  Even
        though it is classed as fiction, I knew some people who
        thought the work was true.

        I could take the rest of the article apart, if I could be
        bothered...but I think that the example is enough to show
        that the truth is never simple and rarely true...:-)


        On 12/01/2016 16:29, Lou Novacheck wrote:

        On Tue, Jan 12, 2016 at 6:45 AM, Michael Best
        <themikebest@xxxxxxxxx <mailto:themikebest@xxxxxxxxx>> wrote:

            Lt. Gen. Ion Mihai Pacepa, the highest-ranking
            intelligence official ever to defect from the Soviet
            Bloc, served as acting chief of communist Romania's
            espionage service and top adviser to President Nicolae

            The highest-ranking Soviet bloc intelligence official
            ever to defect to the West, Lt. Gen. Ion Mihai Pacepa is
            at it again. Today, still living undercover in the
            United States, the man credited by the CIA as the only
            person in the Western world who single-handedly
            demolished an entire enemy espionage service--the one he
            himself managed--takes aim at an even bigger target: the
            exotic, widely misunderstood but still astonishingly
            influential realm of the Russian-born "science" of
            disinformation.Indeed, within these pages, Pacepa, along
            with his co-author, historian and law professor Ronald
            Rychlak, expose some of the most consequential yet
            largely unknown disinformation campaigns of our lifetime.

            Discover answers to many crucial questions of the modern

              * Why, during the last two generations, has so much of
                the Western world turned against its founding faith,
              * Why have radical Islam, jihad and terrorism burst
                aflame after a long period of apparent quiescence?
              * Why is naked Marxism increasingly manifesting in
                America and its NATO allies?
              * What really happened to Russia after the Berlin Wall
                came down?

            Like the solution to a giant jigsaw puzzle lacking one
            crucial piece, Disinformation authoritatively provides
            the missing dimension that makes the chaos of the modern
            world finally understandable. By its very nature, a
            disinformation campaign can work only if the seemingly
            independent Western press accepts intentionally
            fabricated lies and presents them to the public as
            truth. Thus, Pacepa and Rychlak also document how the
            U.S. "mainstream media's" enduring sympathy for all
            things liberal-left has made it vulnerable to--indeed,
            the prime carrier of--civilization-transforming
            campaigns of lying, defamation and historical
            revisionism that turn reality on its head.

              * How destroying the reputation of good leaders has
                been developed into a high art and science.
              * How Pope Pius XII --a generation ago the world's
                most high-profile Christian leader, who personally
                saved countless Jews from Hitler's Holocaust--was
                transformed, through the magic of disinformation,
                into a Nazi sympathizer.
              * How Christianity and Judaism have been targeted for
                constant denigration and defamation through an
                ongoing campaign of disinformation.
              * How the Soviet bloc planted 4,000 agents of
                influence in the Islamic world, armed with hundreds
                of thousands of copies of the most infamous
                anti-Semitic book in history, to fan the flames of
                ancient Arab resentments against the U.S. and Israel
                and sow the seeds of anti-Semitism that would later
                bloom in the form of violence and terror toward Jews
                and Christians.
              * How the defamatory attacks on American soldiers John
                Kerry made before Congress upon his return from
                Vietnam--charges later discredited and
                repudiated--were identical to a contemporaneous KGB
                disinformation campaign concocted to turn Americans
                against their own leaders.
              * How supposedly respectable institutions like the
                World Council of Churches have long been infiltrated
                and controlled by Russian intelligence.
              * How much of the world came to believe that the U.S.
                government itself masterminded the assassination of
                President John F. Kennedy.
              * How the Soviet Union has been transformed into the
                first intelligence dictatorship in history.
              * How disinformation is still very much alive in the
                age of Obama, remaining a powerful engine in the
                ongoing socialist transformation of America.

            All this and much more is meticulously documented in
            Disinformation, with the credibility of an eyewitness
            who was not only there, but actively involved as a
            Soviet bloc spy chief--who, thanks to a crisis of
            conscience, "left the dark side" and came to America to
            help shine a light on the greatest source of political
            evil of the modern age.

            Excerpts posted to:

-- Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious
        triumphs, even though checkered by failure, than to take
        rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor
        suffer much, because they live in the gray twilight that
        knows neither victory nor defeat.
        /~ Theodore Roosevelt/

        How much difference is there between an Obama nation and an

        â€œIncredible change happens in your life when you decide to
        take control of what you do have power over instead of
        craving control over what you don't.
        ~ Steve Maraboli**

        The power of words

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