[creation] Re: Guidelines

  • From: "Marshall" <fefinc@xxxxxxxx>
  • To: <creation@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2005 11:56:18 -0500

Neville,

I was afraid these digressions would get everybody's eyes off the geocentric
(or geostatic) ball...They are certainly time consuming!

But, we can't be certain!  Forcing people to adhere strictly to what
Scripture says on a given doctrine (as opposed to what a dozen churches may
teach) could--I say "could"-- be HIS way of forcing that same kind of
attention to be focused on the non-moving earth Scriptures.

I am glad to see that you reject the eternal torture of conscious billions
by God as an accurate reading of Scripture.  That common Fundamentalist
teaching is a Satanic Bible-destroyer, and a powerful one.

Re: point #4: I am sure you would allow the remarks of Jesus on the subject
(Rev. 2:9; 3:9)...remrks that stemmed from the multitude of non-Semitic
"Jews" brought into the fold from Esther's time and much in control in
Jesus' time.  And I am equally sure that you are fully aware of the mass
conversion of the non-Semitic peoples under King Barun in what became the
Khazar Empire and later spread to Russia, Eastern Europe (Poland
particularly), the Jewish Pale, etc. (all of which is documented in
Encyclopedias and summed up by the Hungarian Jew, Arthur Koestler in his
1976 prize winning book: The Thirteenth Tribe).  Every Jewish leader in
Israel from Ben Gurian to the present is a descendent of these Ashkenazi
Khazarian non-Semitic people.  Neither they nor the rest of the population
in Israel, New York, Miami, or Edinburough can any more trace their ancestry
to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob than an Eskimo can.  All this has nothing to do
with "whosoever will" amongst those who call themselves Jews.  "IF you be
Christ's, THEN are you Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise."
Honest hearted Jews ("the Remnant": Rev. 11:13) will come to Christ at a
specified time (Rom. 11:25), which is at the end of the 6th Trumpet
resurrection of the Two Martyrs...who complete the roster of Martyrs seen in
Rev.20:4 and promised to the 1st century martyrs (Rev. 6:10,11),
etcetera....

These remarks are just meant to bring what I believe are irrefutable
historical and Scriptural facts into focus relevant to the comment in your
statement #4.  If you have hard contrary evidence, I would certainly like to
see it.

Anyway, I remain yours for God's demonstrable Truth on all subjects which
subject He Himself has raised (as in Rev. 2:9 & 3:9).

Marshall

PS: We are pretty close on the major Trinity Doctrine, but there is a tight
Scriptural resolution of this problem, which, I believe, not only can settle
the issue in Christendom, but can also reach out to Moslems and Jews in
particular, and the rest of the world in general.
http://www.fixedearth.com/Trinity%204%20pg.htm    &
http://trinity%2012^20pg.%clarification.htm


----- Original Message -----
From: "Dr. Neville Jones" <ntj005@xxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <creation@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Friday, February 04, 2005 7:09 PM
Subject: [creation] Guidelines


> This is very interesting indeed. One minute we are all sailing along quite
merrily, the next minute all hell breaks loose, if you'll excuse the pun.
>
> Philip (Snow)'s posting, entitled "HELL!!," covered a number of
fundamental, doctrinal issues. Should we here discuss our disagreements,
just as Peter and Paul had to reason out theirs? Well, we could do, as long
as we realize that we are not going to reach a concensus.
>
> You see, on this forum, we have unitarians and trinitarians, Catholics and
non-Catholics, Jews and Gentiles. There is only one thing that unites us
all - we all accept that the cosmos was created by God.
>
> In addition to this, I am under an obligation to maintain, as our main
priority, a technical slant to this forum. This is because freelists.org
provide the service I use, specifically with this proviso.
>
> I therefore have to decree the following:
>
> 1. Our discussions are to be primarily concerning the scientific,
technical and logical aspects of the Creation/evolution debate.
>
> 2. I will allow the discussion of doctrine on the forum, as long as it is
tolerant and as long as all contributors are fully and constantly aware that
they are not here to convert anyone. (Please do not, for example, attack
anyone just because they are Catholic. If you disagree with a Catholic
doctrine - as, indeed, I do - then feel free to politely say so and give
your reasons. Once the point has been made, and defended, then we need to
move on again with those matters that unite us.)
>
> 3. It is up to the individual as to whether they choose to inform the
group of their position on Scriptural teachings.
>
> 4. I will, under no circumstances, allow remarks or postings that are
anti-Jewish.
>
>
>
> Within the context of the above, I am prepared to instigate a discussion
of the word, "hell," based upon my understanding of Scripture:
>
> The word "hell," used in the King James version of the Bible to represent
three original Hebrew and Greek words, conjures up images of a big, horned,
tailed, red bloke with something like a pitch fork, tormenting people. This
is a popular depiction and should, of course, be kept separate from any
meaning that the word itself, which dates from before 1150 AD (or CE), has.
>
> The Hebrew word translated as 'hell' is sheol, which, as far as I
understand it (we do have a native Hebrew speaker on this forum who could
correct me), means the common grave of mankind, that is always reaching out
for more.
>
> The two Greek words are hades, which means a grave, and gehenna, which
means a dump where rubbish is burnt.
>
> Hell, then, is simply the grave. It can be a memorial grave, in which case
the occupier will be resurrected back into a physical body at the last day;
or not, in which case the spirit tossed into it is destroyed, never to
return. There is no torture chamber (much to Rumsfeld's disgust, no doubt).
That it is eternal, simply means that the fire is never quenched, not that
spirits are forever punished.
>
> Jesus' spirit was in a memorial grave for three days, and his first
physical body was (temporarily, until God removed it) placed in a physical
grave. He was never dominated and tormented for three days, nor even for
three nanoseconds, in a fiery "hell" by some sort of "devil." Indeed, such
an idea is unthinkable to me.
>
> I hope that this mail is received by all in the spirit in which it was
written.
>
> Neville.
>
>
>
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