Re: USF4 changes!
- From: Stephen Scheidel <gieroadsteve@xxxxxxxxx>
- To: cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Fri, 20 Jun 2014 07:09:44 +0200
I prefer 16 beers.
On 19/06/2014, Donaldson, Alasdair <alasdair.donaldson@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> I prefer Jameson's 12yr old.
> Will watch that when I get back to the hotel.
>
> From: Ilitirit Sama [mailto:ilitirit@xxxxxxxxx]
> Sent: Thursday, June 19, 2014 11:46 PM South Africa Standard Time
> To: cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Subject: Re: USF4 changes!
>
> I prefer Johnathon Black.
>
> This is a great ad:
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MnSIp76CvUI
>
> One shot, 40 takes.
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 19, 2014 at 11:41 PM, Donaldson, Alasdair
> <alasdair.donaldson@xxxxxxxxxx<mailto:alasdair.donaldson@xxxxxxxxxx>>
> wrote:
> Just going the simple route - Johnny blue.
> From: Ilitirit Sama [mailto:ilitirit@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:ilitirit@xxxxxxxxx>]
> Sent: Thursday, June 19, 2014 11:19 PM South Africa Standard Time
>
> To: cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> <cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>>
> Subject: Re: USF4 changes!
>
> Shot of Don Julio Reposado, slice of pineapple, dab of Wasabi
>
> Don Hara Kiri
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 19, 2014 at 11:09 PM, Donaldson, Alasdair
> <alasdair.donaldson@xxxxxxxxxx<mailto:alasdair.donaldson@xxxxxxxxxx>>
> wrote:
> Wtf? Some overkill there. Just stick to my tequila.
> From: Ilitirit Sama [mailto:ilitirit@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:ilitirit@xxxxxxxxx>]
> Sent: Thursday, June 19, 2014 11:04 PM South Africa Standard Time
>
> To: cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> <cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>>
> Subject: Re: USF4 changes!
>
> That's called a Hand Grenade.
>
> One shot of tequila resting against a shot of Jaegermeister in a glass above
> some red bull. The tequila is the "pin". When you pull it the
> Jaegermeister drops into the red bull and causes the "explosion".
>
> One level up is called a Missile. It's the same thing, but with a shot of
> Absinthe as well. You pull the Absinthe and Tequila and drink them quickly
> after each other. By the time you get to drinking the Jaegerbomb you feel
> like you've been hit by a missile.
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 19, 2014 at 10:39 PM, Donaldson, Alasdair
> <alasdair.donaldson@xxxxxxxxxx<mailto:alasdair.donaldson@xxxxxxxxxx>>
> wrote:
> Erm... Jaeger bombs and tequila... I don't think I'm making work
> tomorrow...
> Not really following the emails either.
>
> From: Ilitirit Sama [mailto:ilitirit@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:ilitirit@xxxxxxxxx>]
> Sent: Thursday, June 19, 2014 10:07 PM South Africa Standard Time
> To: cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> <cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>>
> Subject: Re: USF4 changes!
>
> The gameplay demo of MGSV was awesome, but it does make the Fulton RS seem
> OP. I hope they balance it out nicely in the final version. I mean, it
> costs 1000 GMP for a cardboard box delivery, but only 300 GMP per Fulton?
>
> Game looks incredibly fun though.
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 19, 2014 at 9:26 PM, Wynand-Ben
> <paashaasggx@xxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:paashaasggx@xxxxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
> Ah k
>
> All I know about how its generated is the bit you quoted from Otaku, havent
> seen any interviews myself yet.
>
> While that sounds less impressive it should probably count as a procedurally
> generated "cat" instead of generated "animal". So I guess they could
> technically not be lying... :P
>
>
>
> There will be shortcuts taken. From the 1st time I saw this I was just
> thinking is how the hell will a Indy team manage this?
>
> Will see someday I guess. Hope they take their time and do it properly.
>
> Game looks intriguing
>
> ________________________________
> Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2014 21:09:21 +0200
>
> Subject: Re: USF4 changes!
> From: ilitirit@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:ilitirit@xxxxxxxxx>
> To: cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>
> But that's what I'm saying. From the interview it just sounds like they
> just have blueprints for known animals. Cats, dinosaurs, fish. How many
> ways can you really generate a cat? Who is really going to be impressed
> when they see a spotted panther for the 5th time, only in a different colour
> or size? In Spore, every animal has the potential to look completely
> different. I'm not getting a sense of any of that from what they are doing
> here. They didn't mention anything about exotic animals. They mention that
> deer will exist on different planets but they will look different. That's
> not impressive. Deer exist in different countries on Earth and they look
> different. In Spore, no two animals look the same (well, some do by virtue
> of mutation). So either they're overstating what their engine is capable
> of, or it's not yet ready for a proper demo.
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 19, 2014 at 8:49 PM, Wynand-Ben
> <paashaasggx@xxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:paashaasggx@xxxxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
> Generating tree's and animals could use the same kind of level generation
> algorithms I reckon.
>
> A "exotic" animal could have 1-8 legs. Its ass cant be too close to its
> mouth, the legs need to be in usable positions.
> Or tree's, cant have all the branches/leaves be too close together or oddly
> spread out... so there will be some sort of algorithm to make them look
> "natural".
>
> I dont see how it is any different.
>
>
>
> I still have no real idea what you actually have to do in the game... other
> than "explore". Gather stuff? Trade? Fight? Do what and to what end?
>
> Hopefully they can make it fun.
>
> ________________________________
> Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2014 20:35:15 +0200
>
> Subject: Re: USF4 changes!
> From: ilitirit@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:ilitirit@xxxxxxxxx>
> To: cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>
> If you have a base template and just tweak a few variables, it's not really
> procedural. It's just randomly assigning values to different properties.
> eg. When you click "Random Appearance" on the character build menu in an
> RPG. There's no real algorithm behind it. Procedural level generation on
> the other hand does require an algorithm eg. exit can't be too close to the
> start, every room must have an entrance etc etc.
>
> I also think don't think they're going to be able to deliver what they
> mentioned, or at least make it fun without some big changes. They said the
> gameplay will take place in on true Universal scale. Ignoring the
> mathematics, it honestly sounds like the most boring MMO ever. The odds of
> you running into another player is exceedingly small, and they even
> acknowledge it! What's the point of an MMO where there's little-to-no
> interaction with other players? It might as well be a single-player game.
> I think this is one aspect of the game they will need to rethink very
> carefully.
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 19, 2014 at 8:16 PM, Wynand-Ben
> <paashaasggx@xxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:paashaasggx@xxxxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
> I dont take any marketing jargon seriously... dont see why this is any
> different.
>
>
> Only thing im worried about is that they have bitten off more than they can
> chew. The game sounds and looks good but im not sure if its doable properly
> with a Indy team/budget.
>
> If the size of it is really what they claim it to be then procedural
> generation would be the only way to go. Nobody would create that big of a
> universe by hand.
>
>
> "From the article on Kotaku it seems they just have a base template for
> various classes of animals and plants and they tweak it to give them
> slightly different appearances. That's very different from procedural
> generation."
>
> Why is it different? Diablo 2 levels where procedurally generated... they
> were never the same. (Maybe not never but the odds are that it happened).
> Using sets of preconstructed base items/areas/stuff.
>
> Its just varying degrees. If they builds stuff modular or interchangable
> enough they could "hopefully" generate a shitload of different "Stuff".
>
>
> The scope of the universe alone sounds amazing tho if they can keep it from
> beeing too samey after you have seen too much of their "constructions"
>
> Would be cool if they pull this off
>
> ________________________________
> Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2014 19:57:36 +0200
>
> Subject: Re: USF4 changes!
> From: ilitirit@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:ilitirit@xxxxxxxxx>
> To: cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>
> There's no way I can take any game that makes claims like that seriously.
>
> They start out by saying all footage is captured in real time. Believable.
>
> Then they start talking about procedural generation. Unbelievable.
> So, how much of it then is just marketing blurb? I really doubt they
> generated life algorithmically (they have fish and dinosaurs). It's not
> impossible (Spore did it), but so now I scratch that off my list as well.
> What does that leave you with then? Procedurally generated terrain? That's
> nothing new or interesting.
>
> From the article on Kotaku it seems they just have a base template for
> various classes of animals and plants and they tweak it to give them
> slightly different appearances. That's very different from procedural
> generation.
>
> Those systems Ream mentioned are indeed real. Murray and Ream showed me
> their toolset to prove just how infinite the creatures and objects in their
> game are.
> Ream pulls up a blue-ish menu with lines of code written across the screen
> and quickly clicks across it to pull up a very specific menu within their
> engine. Before I know it, he's selected an option for trees and I'm staring
> at one. There's a blueprint for a fairly standard-looking tree off on the
> right. He clicks a button that says "view variants." Dozens of new trees—of
> different shapes, sizes, and colors—pop up on the left.
> "This is our toolset," Murray says as we scroll through the trees. "We built
> our own engine. It's super crappy, but it's kind of like Unity or something
> like that. We've written it all around procedural generation. And that's
> kind of what we spent the first year, when it was just four of us, what we
> spent our time doing. And then the last month before the VGXs we built the
> trailer using that."
> http://kotaku.com/how-a-seemingly-impossible-game-is-possible-1592820595
>
> Personally I think they're either just throwing the word around for
> marketing hype, or their engine is nowhere near in a state where they can
> start demoing true procedurally generated life.
>
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 19, 2014 at 7:47 PM, Wynand-Ben
> <paashaasggx@xxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:paashaasggx@xxxxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
> Sounds like you are taking a marketing comment a tad too serious...
>
> I fairly sure its just a fancy way of saying the all of the environments are
> procedurally generated.
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2014 19:44:25 +0200
> Subject: Re: USF4 changes!
> From: ilitirit@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:ilitirit@xxxxxxxxx>
> To: cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>
>
> This trailer for this game pisses me off so much that I want to smash my PC
> monitor
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2-v6R_T1hEs
>
> Every atom procedural? WTF does that even mean you morons?
>
> Did you codify the laws of Quantum Physics into your engine so that quarks
> had no choice BUT to assemble into stable atoms?
>
> And if you got that far, why even bother telling us stuff like leaves, rocks
> and planets are procedurally generated? Surely these things should have
> just emerged from your awesome Quantum Physics engine?
>
> Or let's give them the benefit of the doubt and suppose they just have
> algorithms than can arbitrarily combine electrons, protons and neutrons to
> create new atoms (much easier than even understanding Quantum Mechanics).
> There are about 7*10^27 atoms in 70kg human body. Suppose their algorithm
> can procedurally create 100 atoms per microsecond (100 million per second).
> That means in order to create a human it would take 2.22 * 10^9 millenia to
> procedurally generate 1 human.
>
> -_-
>
>
>
>
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