Re: USF4 changes!
- From: Manase Zote <bmlzote@xxxxxxxxx>
- To: cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Thu, 12 Jun 2014 15:56:11 +0200
At this point no one knows how all of the above system mechanics are
going to turn out.
Limiting movement to a bar is a crime in any fighting game because you
need movement for everything you do in a fighting game.
It also affects the pacing of the overall match. So for me limiting
movement to a bar is a gimmick and will only give players more
problems rather than assisting them in a match.
I still don't see how styles can solve bad match ups, zoner will
always have an advantage from range, rushdown owns up-close...
On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 3:42 PM, Di Lhong <numotd@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> There's an agility bar. New bar. Nothing to do with EX bar. It fills up
> pretty quickly. There's 2 bar. You use 1 to perform run or a backdash
> (spaces out quite a bit). I think this is fair. It fills up fast enough to
> use it every now and then. But not enough to just spam nonstop. You use 2 to
> use stage interactables. So it's not a stage interactablefest like
> Injustice. You have to decide if it'll be worth it to use interactables or
> to just dash up to continue pressure / dash away to keep zoning.
>
> As for variation. It's like saying Catwomen decides to do rushdown. And
> Grundy decides to do "zoning" with his zombie ground grab thingy (meaning
> he'll not have his armor chainthrows etc.) Catwomen will just run up to
> grundy with her claw slash and ignore most of Grundy's zoning. I'm hoping
> the character variation is NOT going to be rock/paper/scissors. Hope it
> helps you with really bad match up, but still at the end of the day...it's
> what you do. Because in MK9, i can just spam Kabal's instant air fireball
> like a noob and know some combos and it'll already be hard to win against
> kabal without having to learn his advance nomad dash cancels if you play
> someone who has trouble with zoning.
>
> so instead of choosing a variation and giving you instant win (because you
> only keep a few moveset between variations). i'm hoping variation helps with
> really bad match ups like 9-1 or 8-2 to something like 6-4 or 5-5 and what
> not. because fighting games should be about what you can do as a player.
> just because i know stupid spamming basic kabal shouldn't give me instant
> advantage over someone who's really good with sheeva, scorpion or sub zero
> (don't know which characters have issue with zoning in mk9...)
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 3:25 PM, Manase Zote <bmlzote@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>
>> SAP just told me that you need meter to run?
>> Isn't that supposed to be stone age mechanics(having a meter for running)?
>> Who said running was broken?
>>
>> *Sigh*
>>
>> Back in MK3/UMK3/MK4 that meter also managed your combos so no meter
>> no chain combos no running around :(
>>
>> On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 3:18 PM, Wynand-Ben <paashaasggx@xxxxxxxxxxx>
>> wrote:
>> > Im also not seeing how it can help bad matchups.
>> >
>> > Picking a different version of the same character or a different
>> > character
>> > all together between matches would be just like it was now.
>> >
>> > Counterpicking etc.
>> >
>> >> Date: Thu, 12 Jun 2014 15:11:20 +0200
>> >> Subject: Re: USF4 changes!
>> >> From: bmlzote@xxxxxxxxx
>> >> To: cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> >
>> >>
>> >> How do you get around the rock/paper/scissors character selection?
>> >> Player 1 picks his zoning scorpion while player 2 goes for rush down
>> >> version of scorpion, it will still be a bad match up for one of the
>> >> guys regardless.
>> >> Tools of the characters, match-up exp and lastly the skill level and
>> >> execution will be the deciding factor.
>> >> To me the understanding of a balance fighting is to make every
>> >> character the same...
>> >>
>> >> On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 2:54 PM, Di Lhong <numotd@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> >> > Hmmm a good fighting game shouldn't be all about bad match up and
>> >> > lack
>> >> > of
>> >> > knowledge...it should still be fun and challenging in another level
>> >> > when
>> >> > your opponent knows what your character can do.
>> >> >
>> >> > Yes there are bad match ups and character knowledge in fighting
>> >> > games.
>> >> > but
>> >> > it shouldn't be in a state of "i know what you're doing, but i can't
>> >> > retaliate at all"
>> >> >
>> >> > Eg. Tekken. Capos. If my opponent knows how to deal with relax stance
>> >> > and
>> >> > such. I'll play in another mode :) There is no "instant" win in
>> >> > tekken.
>> >> > you
>> >> > can play bears and still win against top tier character because you
>> >> > the
>> >> > player are just better. shouldn't be bringing a plastic ruler to a
>> >> > gun
>> >> > fight
>> >> > situation. should be more or less "experienced fighter with a
>> >> > slightly
>> >> > blunt
>> >> > knife" vs "an okay-ish fighter with a sharp knife".
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 2:43 PM, Manase Zote <bmlzote@xxxxxxxxx>
>> >> > wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> This method of balancing looks like a throw of dice to me.
>> >> >> It can go either way, you potentially have a scenario where you can
>> >> >> lose a match based on lack of character knowledge rather than skill.
>> >> >> If the game has like 30 characters for an example multiply that by 3
>> >> >> so on average you need to be aware of what all 90 variations are
>> >> >> capable of?
>> >> >> Let's wait and see what the move list looks like and how many moves
>> >> >> will change between 3 variations of a character.
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 2:33 PM, Di Lhong <numotd@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> >> >> > 11.59? XD
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Hopefully the character variation will be some answer to really
>> >> >> > bad
>> >> >> > match
>> >> >> > up. Not sure how they'll balance it tho. It'll be weird to just be
>> >> >> > a
>> >> >> > total
>> >> >> > counter to another characters variation completely. If that's the
>> >> >> > case,
>> >> >> > it'll be more rock paper scissors situation than a fighting game
>> >> >> > lolz
>> >> >> > hopefully the variations will make match ups like 9-1 to 6-4 or
>> >> >> > what
>> >> >> > not. So
>> >> >> > there'll still be unfavourable match ups but not a complete lose
>> >> >> > like
>> >> >> > MK9...eg. Kabal vs Sheeva...
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 2:27 PM, Ryan Williams
>> >> >> > <ryan820509@xxxxxxxxx>
>> >> >> > wrote:
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> I think 12:00 is a safer option Rich :)
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 2:24 PM, <greattekkenmaster@xxxxxxxxx>
>> >> >> >> wrote:
>> >> >> >>>
>> >> >> >>> Is 11:30 fine also?? I wanna get game time as much as I can
>> >> >> >>> Sent via my BlackBerry from Vodacom - let your email find you!
>> >> >> >>> ________________________________
>> >> >> >>> From: Ryan Williams <ryan820509@xxxxxxxxx>
>> >> >> >>> Sender: cpt-fgc-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> >> >> >>> Date: Thu, 12 Jun 2014 14:15:48 +0200
>> >> >> >>> To: <cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> >> >> >>> ReplyTo: cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> >> >> >>> Subject: Re: USF4 changes!
>> >> >> >>>
>> >> >> >>> Heya peeps, we'll be starting the Sat sessions at 12pm to
>> >> >> >>> maximise
>> >> >> >>> game
>> >> >> >>> time.
>> >> >> >>>
>> >> >> >>> Anyone who is keen on starting a little earlier can join us at
>> >> >> >>> that
>> >> >> >>> time.
>> >> >> >>> If you aren't able to make 12pm, that's fine as well.
>> >> >> >>>
>> >> >> >>>
>> >> >> >>> On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 1:39 PM, Ashraf Barendse
>> >> >> >>> <ashraf.barendse@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> >> >> >>>>
>> >> >> >>>> I think she feeling a bit lazy today. She was like "Can I speak
>> >> >> >>>> to
>> >> >> >>>> the
>> >> >> >>>> main owner of the computer" and I was like "he's at work" and
>> >> >> >>>> she
>> >> >> >>>> was
>> >> >> >>>> like
>> >> >> >>>> "k thanx bye"
>> >> >> >>>>
>> >> >> >>>>
>> >> >> >>>>
>> >> >> >>>>
>> >> >> >>>> On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 1:32 PM, Nicholas Robertson-Muir
>> >> >> >>>> <nicmuir@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> >> >> >>>>>
>> >> >> >>>>> I love those.
>> >> >> >>>>> Start talking linux, usually goes well.
>> >> >> >>>>>
>> >> >> >>>>> "move to your start bar"
>> >> >> >>>>> "don't have one"
>> >> >> >>>>> "what version of Windows are you using"
>> >> >> >>>>> "I'm not using Windows"
>> >> >> >>>>> "Open up Internet Explorer"
>> >> >> >>>>> "don't have that either"
>> >> >> >>>>> "open your web browser"
>> >> >> >>>>> "mkay"
>> >> >> >>>>> "install this app"
>> >> >> >>>>> "using my regular tar.z loader or the synaptic package
>> >> >> >>>>> manage?"
>> >> >> >>>>> "huh?"
>> >> >> >>>>>
>> >> >> >>>>> good times.
>> >> >> >>>>>
>> >> >> >>>>>
>> >> >> >>>>> On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 1:22 PM, Ashraf Barendse
>> >> >> >>>>> <ashraf.barendse@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> >> >> >>>>>>
>> >> >> >>>>>> lol, got a call from an Indian sounding lady calling from
>> >> >> >>>>>> "Windows
>> >> >> >>>>>> Technical Department"
>> >> >> >>>>>> How about no.
>> >> >> >>>>>>
>> >> >> >>>>>>
>> >> >> >>>>>> On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 1:20 PM, Ryan Williams
>> >> >> >>>>>> <ryan820509@xxxxxxxxx>
>> >> >> >>>>>> wrote:
>> >> >> >>>>>>>
>> >> >> >>>>>>> "Can I just buy a complete game please?"
>> >> >> >>>>>>>
>> >> >> >>>>>>> Not going to happen in this day and age. Those days are
>> >> >> >>>>>>> over.
>> >> >> >>>>>>>
>> >> >> >>>>>>>
>> >> >> >>>>>>> On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 12:33 PM, Nicholas Robertson-Muir
>> >> >> >>>>>>> <nicmuir@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>
>> >> >> >>>>>>>> LOL
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>
>> >> >> >>>>>>>> I don't know which I hate more about fighting games. The
>> >> >> >>>>>>>> update
>> >> >> >>>>>>>> approach like Street Fighter, or the supposedly new game
>> >> >> >>>>>>>> like
>> >> >> >>>>>>>> Blazblue and
>> >> >> >>>>>>>> Persona.
>> >> >> >>>>>>>> It makes me not want to buy the games anymore, because
>> >> >> >>>>>>>> there
>> >> >> >>>>>>>> will
>> >> >> >>>>>>>> be
>> >> >> >>>>>>>> an Update later.
>> >> >> >>>>>>>> Can I just buy a complete game please?
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>
>> >> >> >>>>>>>> Do I need to buy another Persona now?
>> >> >> >>>>>>>> Do I need to buy another Blazblue now?
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>
>> >> >> >>>>>>>> I'm just ranting because I see there's a new character
>> >> >> >>>>>>>> coming
>> >> >> >>>>>>>> out
>> >> >> >>>>>>>> for P4A
>> >> >> >>>>>>>> ...and I was planning to get the new Blazblue (english
>> >> >> >>>>>>>> version)...
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>
>> >> >> >>>>>>>> In all honesty, the Capcom approach makes more sense to me,
>> >> >> >>>>>>>> as
>> >> >> >>>>>>>> much
>> >> >> >>>>>>>> as I dislike it.
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>
>> >> >> >>>>>>>> On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 12:23 PM, Wynand-Ben
>> >> >> >>>>>>>> <paashaasggx@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>>
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>> A new dark age starting off with a new Guilty Gear I can
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>> definitely
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>> live with :D
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>>
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>> > Date: Thu, 12 Jun 2014 11:59:23 +0200
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>> > Subject: Re: USF4 changes!
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>> > From: gieroadsteve@xxxxxxxxx
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>> > To: cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>>
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>> >
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>> > I'm all for the next FG dark age.
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>> > Wreal wrap.
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>> >
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>> > On 12/06/2014, Ilitirit Sama <ilitirit@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>> > > Mortal Kombat Honest Trailer:
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>> > >
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>> > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OCiVYKmCveY
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>> > >
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>> >
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>> >
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>> >
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>> >
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>> > =========================================================================
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>> >> >> >>>>>>>>> >
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>> > //www.freelists.org/list/cpt-fgc
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>
>> >> >> >>>>>>>>
>> >> >> >>>>>>>
>> >> >> >>>>>>
>> >> >> >>>>>
>> >> >> >>>>
>> >> >> >>>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> =========================================================================
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>> >> >>
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>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >>
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