RE: DRE: CTS community mail

  • From: "Donaldson, Alasdair" <alasdair.donaldson@xxxxxxxxxx>
  • To: "cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx" <cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2015 14:25:00 +0000

We’re digressing a lot here. Yeah, improvements in medical techniques have made 
a huge difference to mortality rates and thus population. I remember the 
minister of health in Slovakia telling people that they should take up smoking 
so that they’d die earlier and save the country some money. He was joking, but 
only a little.

The big thing is that if there are food shortages in the world (which there 
still are), it’s not due to a lack of resources. The idea of ‘less is better’ 
for the environment is one of those great ideas that sounds right and feels 
right and has zero basis in logic. The reason for that is that humans don’t fit 
into any of the usual categories for nature. We adapt. We improve our use of 
resources.

If there were issues with natural resources, then the price of commodities 
would rise over time. They don’t. We improve our techniques and the use of 
resources. Demand decreases, despite population growth. That’s the kinds of 
creature we are.

From: cpt-fgc-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:cpt-fgc-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On 
Behalf Of Di Lhong
Sent: 16 February 2015 4:16 PM
To: cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: DRE: CTS community mail

Not every country improved their farming techniques though.

Overpopulation isn't the only issue that cause starvation or scarce in food 
supplies. Better medical also contributes A LOT. People are living longer than 
they did years ago. So there's new mouths to feed and old mouth to feed where 
in the past it was just the new mouth we need to feed.

On Mon, Feb 16, 2015 at 4:09 PM, Donaldson, Alasdair 
<alasdair.donaldson@xxxxxxxxxx<mailto:alasdair.donaldson@xxxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
You’re talking about sustainability there. Sure we need more farmlands, fish, 
general natural resources. We also improve our farming techniques, genetically 
modify wheat crops, start fish farms, etc.
There are more trees on the planet today than there were 30 years ago.

China can stop farming as long as it can afford to import food. Japan hasn’t 
produced enough food for its population for years. The US produces a massive 
excess. When you hit the point where you have people with cash, but not food, 
people will go back to farming.

From: cpt-fgc-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:cpt-fgc-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> 
[mailto:cpt-fgc-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:cpt-fgc-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>] On 
Behalf Of Di Lhong
Sent: 16 February 2015 3:59 PM

To: cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: DRE: CTS community mail

In a government and population dynamics, it varies.

But as for the world, nature and ecosystem...less is better. Since we need more 
farmlands, fish more, cut down more trees, etc. To supply our needs.

Another issue for more people is that doesn't mean more things is being 
produced either. A lot of chinese farmers have stop farming because they want 
to move into the cities and become happy and rich like how the media promote 
it. That's one reason why rice supply in China is plummeting. Not everyone 
wants to become a farmer when you can sit in air conditioned rooms and work 9-5.

Food is only an issue in some countries. I know china needs to switch to 
insects soon since rice isn't supplying enough.

On Mon, Feb 16, 2015 at 3:52 PM, Stephen Scheidel 
<gieroadsteve@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:gieroadsteve@xxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
I just don't get how Stu seems to think we can just keep on multiplying and 
everything will be fine.
Come on Stu.

On 16 February 2015 at 15:51, Stephen Scheidel 
<gieroadsteve@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:gieroadsteve@xxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
Yeah a middle ground understanding sounds good.


On 16 February 2015 at 15:47, sameegh jardine 
<sameegh@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:sameegh@xxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
lol, I hear you. I think there's a happy compromise somewhere in the middle of 
all of this though.

If people simply consumed less one wouldn't need to cut down the population. 
It's easier to adjust your lifestyle than it is to play with population sizes 
I'd think. Also, even if you cut down the population in terms of size, what's 
to stop the remaining population from simply wanting even more?

My wife and I share a meal at Burger King. We literally cut the thing in half. 
I'm not saying everyone needs to share their burgers but my point is that one 
meal fills both of us sufficiently. People tend to base how much they eat on 
what size their meal comes in and tend to overestimate how much the really need 
:P

On Mon, Feb 16, 2015 at 3:27 PM, Stephen Scheidel 
<gieroadsteve@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:gieroadsteve@xxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
What?
You do realize that you need more things for more people right ?
Less people ~ less things needed.
Population control doesn't have to be approached like china or whatever.
People just need to realize that they should replace themselves, not multiply 
like crazy.
But then you get into the whole "don't tell me how many kids I can have" thing.

Conclusion I've come to when talking about this issue is that most people would 
rather have a big family over a sustainable environment.
And when you try to talk the about conservation for the future they completely 
disregard it as someone else's problem.

Basically Stu hates Earth.

On 16 February 2015 at 15:19, Stephen Scheidel 
<gieroadsteve@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:gieroadsteve@xxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
Countries with stable populations usually have stable economies or whatever it 
is that allows them to be be happy.
I know the tax in most of these countries is very very high but it's fine 
because everyone receiving is also paying.


On 16 February 2015 at 15:15, sameegh jardine 
<sameegh@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:sameegh@xxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
I tend to agree - I think the bigger issue has got to do with resource 
distribution. People tend to want more than what they really need.

On Mon, Feb 16, 2015 at 3:07 PM, Donaldson, Alasdair 
<alasdair.donaldson@xxxxxxxxxx<mailto:alasdair.donaldson@xxxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
Huh?
Too many for what? There is enough space for people to live, more than enough 
food for the whole planet.
Sure there are lots of issues in the world but overpopulation isn’t actually 
one of them.

From: cpt-fgc-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:cpt-fgc-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> 
[mailto:cpt-fgc-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:cpt-fgc-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>] On 
Behalf Of Stephen Scheidel
Sent: 16 February 2015 3:00 PM

To: cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: DRE: CTS community mail

Almost every problem we have as people here on on earth is that there are just 
too many of us.


On 16 February 2015 at 14:57, Nicholas Robertson-Muir 
<nicmuir@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:nicmuir@xxxxxxxxx>> wrote:

Just wrote 4 paragraphs of my thoughts on racism and then deleted it.

Fuck politics.
On 16 Feb 2015 14:49, "Ashraf Barendse" 
<ashraf.barendse@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:ashraf.barendse@xxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
Damn Japs, why they gotta be racist. Slanty-eyed rice eaters.
:P
HBD Jag.

On Mon, Feb 16, 2015 at 2:46 PM, Di Lhong 
<geosaurus8@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:geosaurus8@xxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
Yeah. It's not they discriminate and treat you differently. If you're whatever 
race and you go to japan. They treat you nicely. It's just the idea of sharing 
their environment with people they don't know or foreigners.

Also a lot of issue started when Japan allowed thailand to travel to japan by 
getting a tourist visa on arrival...A LOT of illegal immigrants went in to 
Japan. I think at least 6,000 in the first 3 months. And the thai tourist are 
very loud and dirty...throwing shit everywhere, not lining up, etc. Fuelling 
the japanese xenophobia even more.

On Mon, Feb 16, 2015 at 2:41 PM, Stephen Scheidel 
<gieroadsteve@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:gieroadsteve@xxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
Well there is a difference between pride and hating others.
I get what Di is saying though ~ basically it's not so much that they hate 
other people (they obviously do to some extent) but more that they just want to 
be around their own kind.

On 16 February 2015 at 14:36, Donaldson, Alasdair 
<alasdair.donaldson@xxxxxxxxxx<mailto:alasdair.donaldson@xxxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
Pride?
It’s not pride behind racism. It’s hate.

From: cpt-fgc-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:cpt-fgc-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> 
[mailto:cpt-fgc-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:cpt-fgc-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>] On 
Behalf Of Di Lhong
Sent: 16 February 2015 2:31 PM

To: cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: DRE: CTS community mail

Well, asians are pretty racist and xenophobic...so i'm not too surprise they 
wrote something like that. They're pretty racist and xenophobic among 
themselves too. Chinese vs Japanese. Thai vs everyone else. Etc. Too much pride 
in their own race and country.

On Mon, Feb 16, 2015 at 2:27 PM, Stephen Scheidel 
<gieroadsteve@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:gieroadsteve@xxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
I think it was on some comedy show I was watching where the guy covers some 
similar stuff.
Some old sports team owner was caught saying something racist and there was a 
big stink.
What the fuck do they expect ? the parents of Americans who are 80+ now where 
the generation that finished off the Native american holocaust ffs.

It just sucks when these old geezers still have some power in the world and you 
can't just wheel them down the hallway like crazy old grandma.

On 16 February 2015 at 14:21, Stephen Scheidel 
<gieroadsteve@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:gieroadsteve@xxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
Forced segregation is a shit idea and never works.
I hope nobody is too surprised by this Japanese womans' ideas.
Keep in mind she was 8 years old when the Americans dropped the bombs on them.
She is 83 now.
To expect anything but racism and xenophobia out of her is a bit much.

It's all super wrong but we just shouldn't be surprised.


On 16 February 2015 at 14:08, Stephen Scheidel 
<gieroadsteve@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:gieroadsteve@xxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
HBD Jagson.

On 16 February 2015 at 13:46, Ryan Williams 
<ryan820509@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:ryan820509@xxxxxxxxx>> wrote:

Yeah, read about this earlier. How fucked up can you get.
On 16 Feb 2015 13:04, "Manase Zote" 
<bmlzote@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:bmlzote@xxxxxxxxx>> wrote:

Japan please...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/japan/11414141/Japanese-author-provokes-furious-South-African-response-by-suggesting-a-new-apartheid.html
On 16 Feb 2015 12:53, "Moshe Shevel" 
<jaguguarang@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:jaguguarang@xxxxxxxxx>> wrote:

Haha thanks guys :)
On 16 Feb 2015 12:47 PM, "Sameegh Jardine" 
<sameegh@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:sameegh@xxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
Happy Birthday Jag, hope you have an awesome one :]

On 16 Feb 2015, at 12:41 PM, "Donaldson, Alasdair" 
<alasdair.donaldson@xxxxxxxxxx<mailto:alasdair.donaldson@xxxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
Oh, nice one Ilit. You couldn’t have posted that first thing this morning, 
could you? So we’re now all the schmucks who didn’t realise it was his birthday.

In other news, HDB Jag.

From: cpt-fgc-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:cpt-fgc-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> 
[mailto:cpt-fgc-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Ilitirit Sama
Sent: 16 February 2015 12:37 PM
To: cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:cpt-fgc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: DRE: CTS community mail

HBD Jag!
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