[bookport] Re: the realistic nature of piracy and the reasonableness of the NLS focus on copyright protections (little actual bookport content)
- From: "Christy Porter" <cporter001@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <bookport@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Sat, 29 Sep 2007 12:50:25 -0500
.> It
> would be interesting to learn if certain publishers were consistently
absent
> from the audible catalog of materials.
Well, it's probably easier or more realistic to consider the issue on an
author by author basis, since each work has audio rights that must be
purchased from the author originally. Most major publishers have audio
divisions these days, or make use of existing producers like Recorded Books,
Brilliance, or Books on Tape. Simon and Schuster has it's own division, as
does Random House. Not sure about some of the others. But not every title
they produce is made into an audio book, only the ones they think will make
them money with the general public. And you'll notice that the majority of
books available for general public consumption are still abridged. This is
also a way of "protecting" copyright, or creative work, since you have to go
buy the hard copy to get the whole thing. It's also a factor of the
expected audio attention span of the average user -- not very long! --
rather than of the attention span of people who rely on audio, like us.
[smile]
--Christy
http://caution-blind-driver.blogspot.com/
> -----Original Message-----
> From: bookport-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:bookport-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
On
> Behalf Of albert griffith
> Sent: Saturday, September 29, 2007 4:06 AM
> To: bookport@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: [bookport] Re: the realistic nature of piracy and the
reasonableness of
> the NLS focus on copyright protections (little actual bookport content)
>
> Currently, sound Taxi, a fifteen dollar program will convert Audible
files.
> I originally purchased the program to convert files I received from my
> public library through a service, Net Library. Net Library, and
Overdrive,
> are two audio book publishing concerns which distribute books to library
> lending sites. Both companies offer downloadable books and they have
allot
> to choose from. Sound Taxi allowed me to play the files on my Book Port.
I
> felt cracking their scheme was appropriate civil disobedience since I
wasn't
> distributing them for profit. I'm the guy who stated, some publishers
> didn't want to work with Audible. I only guessed the reason was security
> related but I remember reading there were some concerns in that area I'm
grateful I still have thousands
> of title from which to choose through my local lending library because I
> don't usually like carrying around a cassette player. I sold my book port
> in anticipation of receiving the new model.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: bookport-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:bookport-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
> On Behalf Of Christy Porter
> Sent: Saturday, September 29, 2007 2:24 AM
> To: bookport@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: [bookport] the realistic nature of piracy and the reasonableness
of
> the NLS focus on copyright protections (little actual bookport content)
>
> Good point. If I remember correctly, at one point, each title had a
little
> cd with flames next to it to indicate that burning to cd was possible for
> the title. By the time audible.com redesigned all its webpages, I was no
> longer using the screen, but JAWS, so I don't know if they still indicate
> this for each individual title.
>
> On the other hand, when I was still driving and even now for road trips, I
> burn titles to CD to share over the car audio system since it's more
> interactive on a long trip, and we enjoy sharing some titles. I must have
> 40 to 50 books burned to cd, all in their little paper covers, filed and
> stored [grin]. Yes, I'm such a geek. [laughing], but the cd's are about
the
> only organized thing in the house, so I'm content.
>
> So far, though, I've never run into a title that I could not burn to CD.
> I've not made use of Audible Manager for quite some time, however. Do you
> still have to download the cd burning software as a separate add-on?
> Anyway, personally, I've always been extremely pleased with audible
overall.
>
>
> And I have to agree with what others have said. If someone is really
intent
> on breaking copyright, they'll find a way. It seems to me a matter of
> weighing the potential for making money from selling audiobooks in a
> reasonably protected format that is still somewhat flexible like the
Audible
> books vs. having copyright protection as a primary concern, above and
beyond
> all others.
>
> How much control do authors and publishers have over whether or not their
> titles are included in the NLS system? If they don't have "opt out"
> options, and since the service is not about making money selling the books
> with money going to the authors for their creative work, but about
> distributing the books for free in good faith, then I can understand why
> this issue is far more of a determining factor for the NLS books.
> Personally, I'll just stick with the cassettes until the library players
> come out or until I win the lotto.
>
> When a regular public library buys audiobooks on CD to distribute (or
print
> books, for that matter) , they pay an additional fee for the book based on
> their potential readership to help compensate for the income not being
made
> by forcing everyone to purchase copies. It doesn't cover the difference
by
> any means, of course, and there's no real allotment for the chance that
> someone will photocopy the pages illegally or rip the CD's while the books
> are checked out. But having the books on audio CD for the local library
to
> purchase and lend is part of the advantage of having them on audio cd for
> sale at all, and the author or publisher gets to choose those risks and
the
> potential for income against those risks.
>
> There's no (or very little) potential benefit for the authors and
publishers
> to having their titles in the NLS audio library system. So, yeah, those
who
> didn't choose to take the risk of having their materials on audio cd would
> be justified in their concern for copyright protection in the new NLS
> formats, particularly since those titles could be distributed widely with
> the click of a mouse once they were opened on a single personal computer.
>
> As for who would screw around making 10 to 20 CD's or more for a book and
> then rip them back into the computer in MP3 format? Well, few would do it
> for a single copy to be played on a more convenient player. But money has
> always made boredom more acceptable to many. Someone interested in
serious
> piracy could do it and make cash, or 20 people who wanted to pay a dollar
> each for a single Audible membership and then distribute copies amongst
> themselves might find it less tedious than I would. All you can do is
hope
> such people don't screw it up for the rest of us! But it's hardly such a
far
> fetched idea as your comments seem to imply.
>
> As an example, consider a book like The Historian or one of the other
titles
> I have that are 48 or 50 cd's long and cost about $80 a pop in the
> bookstore? The Historian was originally two audio audible credits or
about
> 24 bucks through audible, and now it's only one credit or about 12 bucks.
> Amazon.com has used unabridged copies listed at $119.00; I don't recall
> seeing this available unabridged on CD in the bookstores, though. Hard to
> come by. Audible's "regular" price for the unabridged version is listed
as
> $68 with the member cash price set at about $48.00 bucks for a 26-27 hour
> long title.
>
> The cheapest way to purchase the title, is, of course, through the
> subscription service at 12 bucks for one credit. With a fast processor,
> your talking about several hours of work to break the copyright through
the
> cd to mp3 long route. Then, even if a schmuck only charged $40 or 50
bucks
> for the book, the schmuck would make a significant amount of money per
> pirated copy for all those who want "just this one title" without paying
the
> premium market worth of the title or undertaking the liabilities of a
> subscription. The creepy pirate would have plenty of takers in a big
city.
> Should Creep have a fast burner and processor and be required to spend
> significant amounts of time at the computer anyway or should creep want a
> way to pay for his World of Warcraft time that he can do while playing
World
> of Warcraft, the time spent to make this title accessible or pirate-able
> would be nothing. Extrapolate now as to the value, ease, and dirty money
to
> be made doing all this over the internet with something instantly
> distributable via download once the protection code was cracked? Creep
> could pay for college, buy even more computers for criminal activity,
> lessons on how to hide his I p address by hacking into and through other
> servers, and STILL spend all day and night playing World of Warcraft.
With
> the money to be made for something that hits pop culture fame, like The Da
> Vinci Code or Tolkien's novels, and the fact that my scenario requires
Creep
> to have little to no skills for coming up with a way to work around the
> protective software, I'm actually surprised it doesn't happen more often.
>
> If the authors and publishers can't opt out of being in the NLS, and we're
> talking about an instantly downloadable book acquired completely for free
as
> the NLS books are, I can understand why they want more than just the
> irritation and time factors to keep people from burning to CD as a
> workaround. Also, given the vast number of titles eventually available
> through NLS, the far reaching nature of potential piracy and the impact
such
> piracy could have on the authors' incomes and returns for creative work
over
> time, yeah, I'd be worried, particularly since the depth of the library
> would make a crack program far more worth developing than it would for
> audible.com's current, though admittedly growing, list of titles? The
easy
> and perpetual access to the books also becomes a significant factor in
> weighing the concerns of potential piracy. For many authors, NLS has
entire
> bodies of work available, not just a single, more recent title, or a
series
> as does audible or recorded books, or Audiobookstand.
>
> Perhaps the only reason piracy hasn't yet happened on a larger scale in
> audiobooks is that the percentage of the population who can actually enjoy
a
> full length audio book is still relatively small when compared to the
> percentage who can read print or who can listen to pirated music. As the
> popularity of audiobooks continues to grow, though, I'm sure the criminal
> element will follow. As it is, we who rely on audiobooks are still
spending
> large amounts of time scrambling to find all the titles we want in spoken
> audio format, so perhaps the potential and feasibility for criminal
activity
> over the next five years is not so easy to recognize as our own
frustration.
> [smile] An I agree with you, I'm surprised they're going to allow the
Icon
> to play the books, too. But I'd never day they are paranoid.
>
> Me, I'll stick to my bookport; it is just dandy for me, and I don't have
> the nerves for that type of thing. When I grow up, retire, or win that
> lotto, I'd love to make my living writing historical trash novels. [grin]
> So I'm interested in maintaining a certain level of copyright protection.
> And, for an individual, as you say, why bother? Audible is quite generous
> with the number of devices you can have activated, so whenever someone's
> wanted to borrow a title, I put it onto my old "Audible Otis" and let them
> borrow the whole thing just like borrowing a paperback. MUCH more
> efficient! I've been using Audible since 2002, so I've plenty of titles
that
> can still go on such an "ancient" gadget. Though I've noticed fewer and
> fewer titles still have the level one or level two formats available.
> Again, as the copyright protections get more sophisticated, so must the
> gadgets, which is exactly where we are with the bookport and NLS. Nice
> loop, yes? Well, maybe more irritating than nice, but there you've got
me.
>
> Oh, and thanks to Pam and APH for being straight with us. You've earned
my
> loyalty yet again! And honestly, by the time you have the chance to
develop
> the bookport 2 at the high quality we've gotten used to, I won't be quite
> so disgruntled over having just gotten mine two years ago and being faced
> with the need to upgrade! [grin]
>
> --Christy
> http://caution-blind-driver.blogspot.com/
>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: bookport-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > [mailto:bookport-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
> On
> > Behalf Of Kitty Litter
> > Sent: Friday, September 28, 2007 7:02 PM
> > To: bookport@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > Subject: [bookport] Re: Audible vs. NLS
> >
> > This is not quite true. The ability to burn certain audible books to
> > CD is built-in to the audible software. If they wanted too, they could
> > remove
> that
> > component from audible manager. Publishers know this and I believe
> > audible can turn this off on a per book basis. Who in their right mind
> > would screw around making ten CD's or whatever and then ripping them
> > to mp3? Most
> people
> > wouldn't bother. And I'm curious whether the guy who said publishers
> > wouldn't allow audible to sell their books because of the lack of
> > security can site the source for that statement?
> >
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