robin, have you read the guidelines at w3c.org? it's a fairly good rundown, even if there tutorials are a bit misleading some of the "handy" things for us is 1. use of headers for sections of the page 2. even if you make it invisible to sighted users (using an transparent giff named...), a "skip to main content" link as the first link at the top of the page is a good thing 3. alt tags for any images you put there such as a logo with an alt tag description 4 though you can use graphical links, make sure the graphics have a distinct and explanatory name, most screen readers when they run into a graphical link give us the name of the graphic since it can't read what the graphic says or give us its pictorial description, a graphic that is named 1324.gif, will be read to us as"link graphic 1324.gif" even if it says home in it, a screen reader can't read graphics, just textual items, thus the use of the graphics name. 4. the least graphics on the page the better, our comps get slowed down by both verbal comprehension of the user, and by the enormous amounts of ram that a screen reader requires, example, (I'm a hardware tech) for a newer computer running vista home basic, the absolute minimum is 1 Gb of ram, and most builders who know systems for the blind will not let it walk out the shop with less than 2 Gb of random memory. 5. list, tables and the like are good, frames will work but are not recommended (I have no problem with them, but some do) 6. java script for anything displayed is not! a good thing to do web page "menus" rarely work right for a screen reader user. and anything moving in the background or blinking will confuse the blazes out of one, so though snowflakes falling in the background of a page may be pretty, and soothing for sighted users, it will run us right off the page in about as much time as it takes one to hit alt f4 or alt left arrow(back) since the point that are readers is focused on changes each time something moves on the page. 7. CGI and php tend to work well for VI (visually impaired) computer users, as does a lot of (I think most) CSS as a general rule. 8. pages with a ton of links on a single page can have us cursing the web page designer almost as loudly as a java script of snowflakes. another point of knowledge for you about screen readers, or at least mine, which is called jaws,and is one of the top three of the ones on the market, is all those nice clickable items in a set of navigation links does not "run across the top of the screen/page" like for a sighted user, instead I get it as a vertical column of links like a drop down list, so you can imagine why a page with a hundred links on it makes me start to get a headache, eh? 9. graphical items are a definite no no, there hard to find if we can find them at all, again the readers can't read them, and they aren't in the same places for us that they would be for you. 10 if you need to you can use a lesser common font on the page, but please stick to the "more common" ones, times new roman and book antiqua are fine, "double phase sun script" may well be unrecognizable to a screen reader. hmmm, what else, oh contrast, for ease of use make sure that you use high contrast and be aware of the color blindness ways as well blue and green are not a good idea and neither is red and yellow since a lot of partially sighted are using screen magnifiers to read the screen, and are color blind and can't make out the borders of the letters from the background. there is a good example of page modifications that take in the VI variations at: http://www.afb.org/ play with the text size controls and take a look at what can be done on the change colors and more... page. this goes above and beyond what is truly needed, but a choice of text size (since some VI are partially sighted and use screen magnifiers instead of screen readers) and being able to choose, at the minimum between a black on white, or white on black page formatting is a fair enough set of variables. ok, I think I am done for the moment, but ask away on anything you need to take care, the crazy elf! ----- Original Message ----- From: Robin L. Clark To: blind_html@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Sent: Wednesday, November 19, 2008 8:22 AM Subject: blind_html List name Question; How do seekers find the list? If it would be a search of the list name, or a first impression from the list name, then it might be better to include any of the words blind, low vision or vision impaired. Got to remember that first impressions really are lasting, and that first impressions are sometimes the last impressions too. I'm fully sighted. I'm also an amateur web site author for a couple of blind and low vision groups. I got on here partly out of curiosity and partly because I need to try to see things the way others see ... or don't ... which ever, so that I can build pages better. It aint dyslexic being easy.