There are so many Braille books available, both in hard copy and .brf files. I
agree with you, Miriam, about the quiet, the experience of reading inside your
own head without something yapping at you. But, even after the long, hard
process of learning to read Braille as an adult at a speed that was at least
quick enough to be enjoyable, I read very little Braille these days. So much is
available in audio of one sort or another, and even .brf files can be converted
to text and read on computer, or other electronic device.
I always mean to get back to reading some book or other in Braille, but
somehow, I never do, and using Braille has become basically the result of
needing information in that format for whatever reason.
If the electronic stuff ever crashes and burns, god forbid, I’m sunk!
On May 24, 2016, at 11:17 PM, Miriam Vieni <miriamvieni@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
It's true that if you learn braille as an adult, you'll read more slowly
than if you learned as a young child. But it is also very possible to learn
and to read books at a passable speed. I know because I did it. There was
much effort involved, but I was highly motivated and I had a really good
teacher. There are certainly more books than just religious tracts, lots of
them, both fiction and non fiction. And I believe that all the Bookshare
books are available in braille also. The real advantage is that the
experience of reading braille is like reading print. It's quiet. It's in
your head. No voice, human or synthetic, distort what the writer is trying
to communicate to you. But for us now? It's slower and more difficult.
However, all my important names and addresses are on 4 by 6 index cards in a
box. I have all kinds of other braille notes. I jot down things, like book
titles or other stuff as I come across it on the computer. If the power is
out, I have two phones that don't depend on power and I don't need to listen
to anything powered by electricity or a battery to find a number. I have
recipes from when I actually cooked meals for people, in braille. I make
braille labels for all my medications. I use brief braille notes for all
kinds of stuff. If someone on the phone, tells me to grab a pencil to write
something down, I write it down on the 5 by 7 card that is always sitting in
my braille writer, just for that purpose. I have another braille writer in
the kitchen where I jot down things for next week's shopping list. To me,
that's faster and more efficient than recording notes. But perhaps that has
to do with my age and related tendency to old fashioned solutions, or to
having had enough partial vision so that reading and writing were my
dominant way of accessing information.
Miriam
________________________________
From: blind-democracy-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:blind-democracy-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Roger Loran
Bailey (Redacted sender "rogerbailey81" for DMARC)
Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2016 10:09 PM
To: blind-democracy@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [blind-democracy] Re: one more thought about the stream and the NLS
player
In fact, I can point to an example of giving up as a part of my cost benefit
analysis. It was Braille. I had actually learned to read it by the time I
gave up too. The trouble was that I was reading at a rate of about one page
every forty-five minutes and each of those forty-five minutes was a grueling
ordeal. Since a Braille page is about a third of a print page it was
incredibly frustrating that I could not go faster. At first I neglected to
practice sometimes because I was not in a mood for self torture. Then I
started considering just how much was available in Braille for me to read
anyway and what kind of material it was. Actually, most of it seemed to be
bibles and religious tracts. I probably could have improved if I had stuck
with it, but I finally decided that it was just not worth the effort. One of
the big advantages of it that had been promoted to me was the ability to
write myself notes, but by then I was using a pocket tape recorder for that.
Most bills I could effectively access by calling the company's customer
service number. They might have Braille menus in restaurants, but I didn't
exactly frequent restaurants much. Altogether it just did not seem to be
worth continuing, so I quit and have used what I learned for only an
occasional label since.
On 5/24/2016 6:15 PM, Alice Dampman Humel wrote:
Sometimes "giving up," if that's the way one wants to look at it is
the result of exactly that cost/benefit analysis to which you refer.
And I take your point that technical things don't come easily to
you.
On May 24, 2016, at 4:03 PM, Roger Loran Bailey (Redacted sender
"rogerbailey81" for DMARC) < <mailto:dmarc-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
dmarc-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
I have no idea how old you are, Alice, butt at the age of
sixty-two I am considered elderly. Somehow the phrase technically minded is
a phrase that I would have never applied to myself. It is, indeed, true that
some people find it easier to learn some kinds of things than others and the
reason I do not consider myself technically minded is because those
technical subjects have always been the most difficult for me. I was always
the type who could take a lab and lecture course and ace the lecture and
flunk the lab. I find that I do my best learning by reading narratives. I
read a history book and I learn history. I read a technical manual and I am
completely lost. I usually don't need to read the history book again, but
just go on to the next history book. I do need to read the technical manual
again, though, and oftentimes I need to read it over and over and intensely
study it. Again, it is often to the point of mental exhaustion and even then
I have only come to understand barely parts of it. In that case I just gird
myself for more mental exhaustion and try again. Of course, as much as I
might want to, I will never learn all of human knowledge. There is just too
much of it and no one person will ever accomplish that task. That means that
I have to do a bit of a cost benefit analysis before I start to learn
something. I have to ask myself if the benefit of learning a certain thing
will be worth the agony of learning it and I know beforehand what kinds of
subjects will give me the most agony. If I decide that the benefit will be
great enough, even if the benefit is only that I just will feel good about
knowing the subject, I will jump into learning it. Sometimes it is easy and
sometimes it is hard. Sometimes it is so hard that I cannot accomplish it.
The example that always comes to my mind as a subject that I could not
master was organic chemistry. Somehow I managed to barely pass my classes in
it, but I really do not think I learned it very well and I tried very hard
too. Nevertheless, it still remains that if you do try to learn something
you might not learn it, but if you give up before you even try you will not
learn it and that is the case no matter how old you are.
On 5/24/2016 3:40 PM, Alice Dampman Humel wrote:
Roger, I had to smile at your distinction between
loving to learn and loving to know. I once had a violin student, she wasn't
half bad, who said to me, I don't want to learn to play the violin, I want
to play the violin. I wonder what ever became of her?
Remember, too, that you are still significantly
younger than Miriam or I, and you are much more technically minded and
inclined than many, and, as I said before, what might be easy for one person
to grasp might be extremely difficult for another whose intelligence is of a
different nature.
And, I must say, Miriam has far from given up, and,
although she doesn't seem to think this about herself, she is capable of
doing a hell of a lot with computers and other devices she uses well and on
a regular basis.
Alice
On May 24, 2016, at 3:15 PM, Roger Loran Bailey
(Redacted sender "rogerbailey81" for DMARC) <
<mailto:dmarc-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> dmarc-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Struggle is the right word. In 2003 I bought
a computer and found that about the only thing I knew about it was how to
even plug it in and I was lucky to know that. I then proceeded to teach
myself how to use it. I was determined to not have wasted all that money I
had spent on it. Very often I would work with it all day and go to bed
absolutely mentally exhausted and then start again the next day. I actually
had a technical support number to call, but I didn't know what it was and
the fact that the word technical was in it kept me from calling because I
thought it would be over my head. Eventually I did find that the more I
learned the easier it was to learn something else. Then I discovered
technical email lists. My first one was the Bookshare volunteer list. It was
from that list that I learned how to transfer files. I found out that my
learning rate did increase considerably once I started reading those
technical support lists. There are still a lot of things I do not know how
to do though. For one thing, I really don't know where to start in handling
PDF files and I keep telling myself that I really should get around to
tackling that too. One thing is certain. If I had told myself that I am too
old to learn and then given up before I even started you would not be
reading my words now. I have said here before that I love to learn. That is
not exactly true. Learning can be exhausting and it can be very tempting to
give up. What I love is knowing. The trouble is that one cannot know without
learning. So I gird myself and get down to learning so that I can then know.
Before I ever touched a computer that became a habit for me and I still
remember experiencing some mental exhaustion in other areas such as
trigonometry or chemistry.
On 5/24/2016 11:11 AM, Alice Dampman Humel
wrote:
Miriam,
Believe you me, it was an enormous
struggle, but I'm nothing if not persistent and determined, so.and I am also
sadly aware that I don't know how to do half of what I am sure can be done
on this computer, the iPhone, and with VoiceOver.
So it has far less to do with
ability than you might think.I don't have that much ability, either.
I think many of us are in the same
boat.we were plain and simple too old when all this techno stuff exploded
onto the scene!
Alice
On May 24, 2016, at 10:41 AM, Miriam
Vieni <miriamvieni@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Alice,
I'm envious of your ability to learn
new things. I'm actually avoiding
upgrades and anything new if I can
help it. I was never trained properly on
computers, have no knack for them,
and didn't learn new stuff easily on
themwhen I was younger. At this
point, if I can just do the things I know
how to do, I'm grateful. At some
point, I'll have to upgrade something and
then I'll be in a mess!
Miriam
________________________________
From:
blind-democracy-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:blind-democracy-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Alice Dampman
Humel
Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2016 10:02 AM
To: blind-democracy@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [blind-democracy] Re: one
more thought about the stream and the NLS
player
If you use a Mac, you don't even
have to bother with all that companion or
unzipping.
The Mac automatically unzips the
book, and all you have to do is copy it
onto the sd card or the cartridge.
I know Apple products are not for
everyone, but I, for one, am glad I put in
the effort to learn at least part of
what can be done on the Mac with
VoiceOver and how to do it and
thereby released from these constant JAWS
upgrades and the giant conglomerate
of Microbloat, the incompatibilities of
JAWS with different websites and
software, etc.
Not an endorsement, advice or
recommendation, just FYI, one person's
experience and opinion. On May 24,
2016, at 9:20 AM, Miriam Vieni
<miriamvieni@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
I'm glad that you are enjoying the
stream. There is a piece of
software from
Humanware that was developed for the
stream 1. It's called the
Humanware
Companion Software. Once it's
downloaded, it makes transferring and
opening
books very easy.
Miriam
-----Original Message-----
From:
blind-democracy-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[
<mailto:blind-democracy-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
mailto:blind-democracy-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
Martian.Lady
Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2016 1:13 AM
To: blind-democracy@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [blind-democracy] Re: one
more thought about the stream and
the NLS
player
Hi
I definitely am not a blind gadget
geek. I have a Windows 7
computer
because Microsoft made me give up my
Windows XP computer. I have a
flip
phone from Walmart which cost
$19.95. I bought a Victor Stream so I
could
download BARD and Book share books
directly because I didn't know
how to
transfer books from the BARD site
through the computer. As I said
before I
love my stream.
Marsha
