I don't see how you think this is us shaping the government. You list
things the ruling class wants and show how they got them at our expense.
It is they who shape the government. That is why they are called the
ruling class. They rule. Whatever role we have had in shaping the
government is in the form of concessions wrung out of them through
strikes, mass movements and other fightbacks. It is still not our
government. It is their government.
On 9/11/2016 3:22 PM, Frank Ventura wrote:
All good points and remember we shaped the government. We wanted a strong military and we got the military industrial complex. We wanted cheap goods and we got the immigration issue. We wanted smaller government and we got a greatly reduced social safety net. We wanted a mandatory sense of national unity and now we have armed militas and patriot groups to enforce that at, even at gunpoint. We wanted an artificial feeling of security so now we have the patriot act, drones and wire tapping. Where will it stop?
Frank
*From:*blind-democracy-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:blind-democracy-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] *On Behalf Of *Alice Dampman Humel
*Sent:* Sunday, September 11, 2016 12:38 PM
*To:* blind-democracy@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
*Subject:* [blind-democracy] Re: Attack on the Twin Towers
I agree with Miriam…no matter how much any of us dislikes and protests the actions of the US government, no matter how much any of us distances him/herself from actions and positions we find repugnant, it’s still “we.” And if you don’t believe Miriam or me when we say so, think about how an enemy would treat even the most outspoken protester among us if he/she were captured or if the US were invaded by an enemy force that blew through his/her city or neighborhood. It truly is shoot first and ask questions later. Michael Moore, Noam Chomsky, or Bill O’Reilly or Rush Limbaugh, they’re all the same to the “other side,” whatever that happens to be on any given day. And we, the US, ourselves have done exactly the same thing…when the government decided to imprison all Japanese in camps during WWII, they did not make exceptions for those families who had sons, husbands, fathers, who were at that very moment fighting in the US forces, defending the very country that was imprisoning their families. So, like it or not, we’re all part of the we until someone decides to renounce his/her citizenship and leave the country to find one whose citizenship he/she would find more palatable and, I might add, a country who would accept his/her application for citizenship or political asylum. How many starry eyed Communists tried to move to the Soviet Union only to be told, we don’t want rabble rousers like you here in the USSR?
Donne said it best: no man is an island.
On Sep 11, 2016, at 8:29 AM, Frank Ventura <frank.ventura@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:frank.ventura@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
Yes, but we keep giving them more and more power due to some
twisted sense of idol worship or worse still cut off our nose to
spite our face portests.
Frank
-----Original Message-----
From: blind-democracy-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
<mailto:blind-democracy-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
[mailto:blind-democracy-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Roger
Loran Bailey
Sent: Saturday, September 10, 2016 7:45 PM
To: blind-democracy@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
<mailto:blind-democracy@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [blind-democracy] Re: Attack on the Twin Towers
Just because we may benefit from some concessions that the working
class
has wrung out of the bourgeois state does not make us a part of their
system.
On 9/10/2016 4:12 PM, Miriam Vieni wrote:
Yes, well we can all disapprove of our government's policies.
We can disavow
them. But at the same time, we all benefit, some of us more
than others,
from being US citizens. One simple example, we have all
received services
for the blind. The quality of those services may vary greatly,
just as our
ability to use them varies in terms of our individual
situations. All of us
on this list have computers, a place to live, enough to eat.
Those things
might not be true if we lived in India, Bahrain, or Kenya. In
the same way
that white people don't want to admit that regardless of
whether they want
it, they have white privilege. American leftists don't want to
admit that
whether or not they approve of what our country does, they
benefit from
living here.
Miriam
-----Original Message-----
From: blind-democracy-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
<mailto:blind-democracy-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
[mailto:blind-democracy-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
Roger Loran
Bailey (Redacted sender "rogerbailey81" for DMARC)
Sent: Saturday, September 10, 2016 3:12 PM
To: blind-democracy@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
<mailto:blind-democracy@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [blind-democracy] Re: Attack on the Twin Towers
I understand completely and I congratulate Carl because he has
been prone to
using the word we when he should be saying they too. What the U.S.
government does is what they do, not what we do. What the
imperialists do is
what they do, not what we do. To constantly refer to them as
we shows an
identification with the enemy and that is exactly what the
enemy wants you
to do. It makes it easier to rule over you and to exploit you
if you think
you are a part of what they are doing.
On 9/10/2016 12:10 PM, Miriam Vieni wrote:
Carl,
I'm not sure I understand. You are a US citizen. You pay
taxes. You vote.
It is the US government that has declared an unending war
on terror.
It is the US government that has approximately 1,000
military posts
throughout the world. True, you're not wealthy and you
have little to
no control over what your government does. But if you're a
citizen and
the US has more military power than any other country, why
aren't you
part of the empire? Maybe you're an unwilling part, but
the reality
exists that as an American, you cannot dissociate yourself
from the
empire, except in your heart.
Miriam
-----Original Message-----
From: blind-democracy-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
<mailto:blind-democracy-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
[mailto:blind-democracy-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
Carl Jarvis
Sent: Saturday, September 10, 2016 11:34 AM
To: blind-democracy@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
<mailto:blind-democracy@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [blind-democracy] Re: Attack on the Twin Towers
You'll find the information I've included at the end of
this note to
be interesting if you are wanting to attend community
college in
Tennessee.
But first I wanted to suggest that it was not the policies
of our
Country in the Mid East that has brought about the
violence and hatred
of America. It is the policies of the American Empire
that have done
so. Speaking for myself, I do not consider myself to be a
member of the
American Empire.
I was born a citizen of the United States of America, into
the Working
Class, not the Oligarchy, which has ruled this nation
since the
writing of the Declaration of Independence. As such, my
interests are
not especially those of the Ruling Class. Nor do they
listen to me,
or want my input into their affairs. The Ruling Class can buy
anything they wish, which is a very difficult thing for
the Working
Class to do. Of course I understand that as far as the
World is
concerned, I am one of the hated Americans. .
Carl Jarvis
And now for information about Pellissippi State:
Pellissippi State is a vital institution accustomed to
transformation
and growth. Since its founding in 1974 as State Technical
Institute at
Knoxville, the College has expanded the teaching of
technology, the
use of technology in instruction, and the transfer of
technology to
local business and industry in support of regional
economic development.
Having enrolled only 45 students in its first year of
operation, the
institution experienced steady growth in the '70s, adding
business
technology programs to its original core of engineering
technology
programs.
As community awareness grew, so did expectations. In 1988, the
Tennessee Board of Regents approved the expansion of the
technical
institute's mission to include college transfer programs.
This mission expansion was accompanied by a name change to
Pellissippi
State Technical Community College, and enrollment grew
quickly. In
2009, the Legislature voted to shorten the name. The
institution is
now known as Pellissippi State Community College.
The College continues to support and develop career-path
associate's
degrees, associate's degrees for transfer, certificates, and
continuing education opportunities for the citizens of
Knox, Blount,
and surrounding counties. Pellissippi State offers credit
courses to
high school students as well. In partnership with the
community, the
College sustains the effort toward an ever-improving
quality of life for
residents of East Tennessee.
In fall 2012, 11,259 credit students were enrolled at
Pellissippi
State, as well as thousands of non-credit students.
On 9/10/16, Martian.Lady <martian.lady@xxxxxxxxx
<mailto:martian.lady@xxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
Hi
Where was I when the attack on the Twin Towers
happened? I was
doing my OJT at Palasippi, no idea how to spell it,
couldn't find it"
State Community college which was just outside of Oak
Ridge Tennessee.
That was a bit scary.
For the rest of this message, please don't come
down on me with
all four feet.
yes the attack was a terrible thing to happen. Yes
almost 3,000
innocent people were killed. After the attack, the
world supported
us in this tragic event. We refused to take advantage
of this
support, choosing to take our own course.
We, as a country, refuse to mourn the possible
millions of
innocent people we have killed.
This is rambling because my mind is going slightly
crazy. I nee
a cat to sooth me.
Marsha
