[bksvol-discuss] Re: What several gramatical publications say about the ellipsis.
- From: Cindy Rosenthal <popularplace@xxxxxxxxx>
- To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 02:09:20 -0800 (PST)
After reading all the posts I decided to read what
Mayrie wrote, which I had skipped because I understood
ellipses.
Basically, the irst sources she quotes have to do with
the uses of ellipses rather than how they are written.
I have never seen them in a print book without spaces
between them, except, of course, that when they follow
the end of a sentence the period at the end of the
sentence is a period and so no space would precede it.
Bringhurst's book is written for typographer--people
who set type for printing books and newspapers, though
less and less of that is being done these days. She
doesn't note, nor did I look up, when that was
written.
But for purposes of our Braille readers, it seems that
no spaces between the dots is preferable, and so I've
been deleting them when validating, i.e., now that the
new site is coming online, proofreading. I don't know
what daisy readers hear--do the voices say ellipses or
do they say dot space dot space dot space. If the
latter, I suppose it would be preferable to her dot
dot dot.smile (Am I write that Daisy is audio?)
Cindy
--- Julia <julia.kulak@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> Oh, ok, that's good to know.
> Thanks. Write to me off list when you get a chance.
> Julia
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Mayrie ReNae" <mayrierenae@xxxxxxxxx>
> To: <bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Friday, January 09, 2009 6:35 PM
> Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: What several
> gramatical publications say about
> the ellipsis.
>
>
> > Hi Julia,
> >
> > The upshot is that depending upon who you ask, the
> ellipsis is
> > supposed to be represented either with or without
> spaces separating the
> > dots. So, whichever way people choose to do it,
> they're correct as far as
> > visual representation is concerned. At least,
> that's what I understood.
> >
> > Mayrie
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > [mailto:bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
> Behalf Of Julia
> > Sent: Friday, January 09, 2009 3:22 PM
> > To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: What several
> gramatical publications say
> > about
> > the ellipsis.
> >
> > Wow, this is very complicated, and if I may say
> so, quite technical and
> > confusing. Maybe if I knew unicode it would make
> more sense.
> > Julia
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: <mayrierenae@xxxxxxxxx>
> > To: <bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > Sent: Friday, January 09, 2009 4:30 PM
> > Subject: [bksvol-discuss] What several gramatical
> publications say about
> > the
> >
> > ellipsis.
> >
> >
> >> Hi Guys,
> >>
> >> Oh, boy! The ellipsis gets complicated if you
> look into it. Here
> >> are some statements that I found about its usage
> and how it can and
> >> should
> >> be typed.
> >>
> >> Have fun!
> >>
> >> See below.
> >>
> >> Mayrie
> >>
> >> In English
> >>
> >> The style and use varies in the English language.
> >> The Chicago Manual of Style
> >> suggests the use of an ellipsis for any omitted
> word, phrase, line, or
> >> paragraph from within a quoted passage. There are
> two commonly used
> >> methods
> >> of using
> >> ellipses: one uses three dots for any omission,
> while the second makes a
> >> distinction between omissions within a sentence
> (using three dots: .?.?.)
> >> and
> >> omissions between sentences (using a period and a
> space followed by three
> >> dots: . .?.?.). An ellipsis at the end of a
> sentence with no sentence
> >> following
> >> should be followed by a period (for a total of
> four dots). The
> >> Modern Language Association
> >> (MLA) however, used to indicate that an ellipsis
> must include spaces
> >> before
> >> and after each dot in all uses. If an ellipsis is
> meant to represent an
> >> omission,
> >>
> >> square brackets
> >> must surround the ellipsis to make it clear that
> there was no pause in
> >> the
> >> original quote: [ .?.?. ]. Currently, the MLA has
> removed the requirement
> >> of
> >> brackets in their style handbooks. However, the
> use of brackets is still
> >> correct as it clears confusion.
> >> [1]
> >>
> >> According to Robert Bringhurst's
> >> Elements of Typographic Style
> >> , the details of typesetting ellipses depend on
> the character and size of
> >> the font being set and the typographer's
> preference. Bringhurst writes
> >> that
> >> a
> >> full space between each dot is "another Victorian
> eccentricity. In most
> >> contexts, the Chicago ellipsis is much too wide"
> ? he recommends using
> >> flush
> >> dots,
> >> or
> >> thin-spaced
> >> dots (up to one-fifth of an
> >> em
> >> ), or the prefabricated ellipsis character (
> >> Unicode
> >> U+2026,
> >> Latin entity
> >> …). Bringhurst suggests that normally an
> ellipsis should be spaced
> >> fore-and-aft to separate it from the text, but
> when it combines with
> >> other
> >> punctuation,
> >> the leading space disappears and the other
> punctuation follows. He
> >> provides
> >> the following examples:
> >>
> >> i?? j
> >> k?.
> >> l?, l
> >> l,?? l
> >> m??
> >> n?..!
> >>
> >> In legal writing in the United States, Rule 5.3
> in the
> >> Bluebook
> >> citation guide governs the use of ellipses and
> requires a space before
> >> the
> >> first dot and between the two subsequent dots. If
> an ellipsis ends the
> >> sentence,
> >> then there are three dots, each separated by a
> space, followed by the
> >> final
> >> punctuation.
> >>
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> >>
> >
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