[bksvol-discuss] Re: Qustion on manual

  • From: "Martha Rafter" <mlhr@xxxxxxx>
  • To: <bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Mon, 21 Nov 2011 20:59:01 -0500

Hi Doug,  AMEN!

From: Doug Maples 
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2011 4:12 PM
To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: Qustion on manual

"Simpler and shorter is better" may be somebody's consensus, but definitely not 
from the point of the readers. Having done so many books for children with 
image descriptions and captions, there is no way that you could leave off the 
"image" or "caption" and expect the reader to have a clue what they are 
actually reading. Anyone who is not a Bookshare volunteer will have no idea 
what the words in the quotes means. How can they? If you are not told something 
is an image or a caption, how are you to have any idea what you are reading? I 
just don't get it.

 

Whether you're site reading, using a screen reader or braille, it leads to mass 
confusion. I have to say that I had not seen the finished product of a book 
processed through Benetech's Poet tool, but I certainly hope that there is some 
way to let readers know that the words they run into are not part of the text 
from the book. Descriptions should be easily understood to be a picture 
description. Likewise, picture captions should be just as easily understood to 
be a caption.

 

I think if we (Bookshare volunteers) keep this discussion up, we will 
understand what the text we run into after we have finished really is. But we 
have to remember we are not scanning and proofreading and using different 
notations for various parts of a book just for our understanding. What we put 
down on the page is going to be read by hundreds or thousands of Bookshare 
subscribers. How can we expect them to know what they are reading or listening 
to if we don't give them a cue with a simple word like "image" or "caption"?

 

Poet will do whatever it does, but until then I think we have to let the 
readers know just what it is they are reading.

 

Possibly just one man's opinion,

– Doug

 

From: bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
[mailto:bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Scott Rains
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2011 11:49 AM
To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: Qustion on manual

 

This discussion is good for purposes of clarification. The consensus has been 
that simpler and shorter is better thus avoidance of "image" after the opening 
square bracket. 

 

At the same time, keep in mind that bracketed captions or image descriptions 
inside the text will fade away. As we adopt the image description methodology 
behind Benetech's Poet tool this material will no longer disrupt the book text. 
It will be embedded in the .xml. That way the DAISY reader can be set to show 
or hide the added material. Depending on the manufacturer these third party 
products may or may not alert the reader with a phrase like, "Start caption."

 

Scott Rains

Bookshare

To: "bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx" <bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: Qustion on manual

 

Hi, makes perfect sense to me. Call the thing what it is. If the caption is a 
caption, why not just say "picture caption" to get rid of confusion? Regards, 
Kim Friedman.

-----Original Message-----
From: bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
[mailto:bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Doug Maples
Sent: Saturday, November 19, 2011 8:02 PM
To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Cc: 'Scott Rains'
Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: Qustion on manual

I totally agree with Valerie. When I see something inside of brackets with the 
image: at the beginning, I would just assume that whatever is inside of quotes 
has something to do with the image description. I would never know that was a 
caption. I firmly believe that the caption should have caption: before it. 
Otherwise, how are you going to know?

 

– Doug

 

From: bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
[mailto:bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Valerie Maples
Sent: Saturday, November 19, 2011 4:58 PM
To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Qustion on manual

 

Vivian mentioned she had found in the volunteer manual to simply enclose a 
caption in quotes, as mentioned here:

 

https://wiki.benetech.org/display/BSO/4.8+Y.+Format+for+image+description+tags#4.8Y.Formatforimagedescriptiontags-formattouseforimagedescriptionswithcaptions

 

The example given is:

 [image: A young boy in mid-air as he dives off a pier into a small lake. 
Already in the water is an older man, standing and smiling.
"Having fun on hot days."]
 

But I have always done it like this:

 

 [image: A young boy in mid-air as he dives off a pier into a small lake. 
Already in the water is an older man, standing and smiling.
caption: Having fun on hot days.]

 

I can develop new habits, but to me, the other is more clear, espcially if the 
caption is a quote already in quotation marks.  Is there a reason for the 
change?

 

Valerie 

 

Keep up with Nichole's recovery:
http://www.caringbridge.org/visit/nicholemaples 

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