Thanks, Jake. That solves the skipping a line or not question. what about indenting paragraphs. I can't quite tell from your note whether indenting is o.k.--nay, good--or just leaving paragraphs alone if they are not indented but do have the paragraph symbol at the end of each one. Cindy P.S. Are you up late studeying or are you, YAY!!~ finished? smile --- Jake Brownell <jabrown@xxxxxxxxx> wrote: > Cindy, > > It doesn't really matter whether you insert a blank > line or not. Why not? > Because: > > BookShare tools analyze the text and mark them up > with special tags. They do > so using XML, a language that is meant for marking > up documents. One of the > common tags represents a paragraph. > > The tools mark streams of text into paragraphs > whether they are followed by > a single line break or a double one. > > So skipping lines doesn't matter because the tools > are going to determine > what a paragraph is. > > In the DAISY case, the software used to read the > material will look at the > files and see the marked up text. It then decides > (sometimes based on user > preferences) how to display a paragraph. When viewed > with a web browser it > looks much like a web pages paragraphs, and most > screen readers will > simulate a blank line in between paragraphs. If > something like Kurzweil is > used there is no blank line simulation. It's all up > to the software! > > In the case of Braille, there are specific rules for > displaying paragraphs > that the translator will follow. Again though if the > file is read > electronically rather than on hard copy Braille > paper, the user may be able > to use software settings to tailor paragraph output > to his or her specific > liking. > > So finally, it doesn't matter what you give the > tools, skipped line or not. > What users prefer is up to them, but by that same > token it is their > responsibility to setup their reading apparatus to > their liking. > > I hope this makes the waters a little more clear. > > Jake > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Grandma Cindy" <popularplace@xxxxxxxxx> > To: <bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> > Sent: Saturday, December 23, 2006 1:06 AM > Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: Questions about > brackets, Braille translation, > and multiple spaces between words > > > > THe misconception might have arisen from the fact > that > > one member complained about "reading" (I don't > know if > > it is Braille or sound) spaces used for indenting > or > > other formatting. I've solved the problem by > setting > > the first line in paragraph in the Format file to > .2 > > or .3 It means that sometimes I have to change the > > first line of the page to None, but that's a minor > > problem. > > > > A long time ago when I asked if people preferred > > indented paragraphs or lines skipped between > > paragraphs, the majority who answerd said they > > preferred indented paragraphs. Is it necessar to > do > > anything? Does the paragraph symbol at the end of > one > > paragraph indicate the next paragraph? Is that > > sufficient for Braille or Daisy readers, or should > be > > indent if paragraphs are indented in the book, for > > those who do have sight, all or a little. > > > > Someone sent me an article, the first of a series > of > > Minneapolis NPR, about three blind people and how > they > > "see" Christmas. In the course of that first part > it > > said that all three were legally blind, (from > > different causes and for different lengths of > time) > > but were not totally blind. It said that only 10% > of > > legallhy blind people are totally blind. That > seemed a > > small number to me, but I assume it is correct. > > > > Cindy > > --- Pratik Patel <pratikp1@xxxxxxxxx> wrote: > > > >> Maria et al, > >> > >> I am not aware of bracket problems with braille > >> translations. As far as > >> I've seen, Bookshare tools are able to convert > >> brackets. If this is a > >> recent phenomenon, then, as usual, I would > >> appreciate specific book titles > >> where people know brackets are supposed to exist. > I > >> will be happy to do > >> comparisons. > >> > >> As far as spacing goes, Bookshare tools do not--I > >> repeat, do not--remove > >> extra spaces. As a self-flagellating person, I > >> would love to be proven > >> wrong. So, specific examples would be very > helpful. > >> You just need to be > >> careful of headers and/org footers. > >> > >> Pratik > >> > >> _____ > >> > >> From: bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > >> [mailto:bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On > >> Behalf Of Maria Kristic > >> Sent: Friday, December 22, 2006 11:56 AM > >> To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > >> Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Questions about > brackets, > >> Braille translation, and > >> multiple spaces between words > >> > >> > >> > >> Hi all, > >> > >> In reading some of the recent messages on-list, > I, > >> as someone new, have a > >> few questions. > >> > >> 1. First, about brackets. Someone mentioned that > >> brackets didn't appear > >> in Braille copies of books. As there is a Grade 2 > >> Braille equivalent for a > >> bracket, albeit two cells long (dot 6, dots > 2-3-5-6 > >> for an opening bracket > >> and dots 2-3-5-6, dot 3 for a closing one), I'm > >> wondering, what does the > >> Braille translation software used by Bookshare do > to > >> them? I would think > >> that, since there is a Braille character for > them, > >> they are translated > >> correctly, but apparently, that's not the case? > >> What's done to them, then? > >> Are they converted in to words, as in the words > >> "left bracket" or "right > >> bracket"? I know that Duxbury will convert > symbols > >> with no Grade 2 > >> equivalents to words rather than leaving them in > >> Computer Braille, and I > >> can't even begin to tell you how much that > irritates > >> me (for instance, a \ > >> symbol would appear in a BRF file as literally > the > >> word "backslash" (without > >> the quotes)), but I just checked with it, and > even > >> Duxbury translates them > >> correctly, which is making me wonder? If no one > >> knows for sure, can someone > >> please point me to a book which they know should, > in > >> theory, contain > >> brackets, so that I can take a look to see for > >> myself? I ask because I used > >> them in Girl in the Shadows, so I want to know > >> whether anything out of the > >> ordinary happens with them; this way, I can > decide > >> whether I should be > >> worried about this issue or not. > >> > >> 2. Second, out of curiosity, does anyone happen > to > >> know which Braille > >> translation software Bookshare uses? If something > >> strange is indeed > >> happening to brackets, I'm wondering which > >> translator exhibits this odd > >> behavior? > >> > >> 3. Finally, I'm wondering about the issue someone > >> mentioned about words > >> with multiple spaces between them. I thought I'd > >> read on this list before > >> that the software which converts books to BRF and > >> DAISY converts all > >> multiple spaces in to one (someone was told, > >> therefore, not to indent > >> paragraphs), so I'm confused. If the software > >> converts all multiple, > >> consecutive spaces to one, how can there still be > >> words with multiple spaces > >> between them? Does this stripping of spaces take > >> place only in specific > >> places, such as the beginning/end of a page, the > >> beginning of a sentence, or > >> somewhere else? > >> > >> Thanks much to anyone who can clarify this for > me, > >> and hope all of you have > >> a happy holiday season! > >> > >> Regards, > >> Maria > >> ________________________________________ > >> Maria Kristic > >> Skype: MariaKristic > >> AIM: MCKristic > >> E-Mail and MSN: <mailto:maria6289@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> > >> maria6289@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > >> Google Talk: <mailto:Maria.Kristic@xxxxxxxxx> > >> Maria.Kristic@xxxxxxxxx > >> Yahoo Messenger: <mailto:mariakristic@xxxxxxxxx> > >> mariakristic@xxxxxxxxx > >> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > To unsubscribe from this list send a blank Email > to > > bksvol-discuss-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > > put the word 'unsubscribe' by itself in the > subject line. To get a list > > of available commands, put the word 'help' by > itself in the subject line. > > > > > > > > -- > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > > Version: 7.5.432 / Virus Database: 268.15.26/597 - > Release Date: > > 12/21/2006 6:45 PM > > > > To unsubscribe from this list send a blank Email to > bksvol-discuss-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > put the word 'unsubscribe' by itself in the subject > line. To get a list of available commands, put the > word 'help' by itself in the subject line. > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! 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