[bksvol-discuss] Re: More fun with footnotes! (LONG)
- From: Cindy <popularplace@xxxxxxxxx>
- To: "bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx" <bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2012 18:29:49 -0700 (PDT)
Oh, Good. That clears that up for me. I'll ll change the notes I saved. I did
have "put the word before the footnotes and wasn't sure if it meant in front
or in the space after the text. In books I've done before I've had 3 asterisks
between the text and the end-of-page footnotes and the footnotes in an 8-point
font (because I'd used 10 point for photo descriptions and captions)
>________________________________
> From: Deborah Murray <blinkeeblink@xxxxxxxxx>
>To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 5:12 PM
>Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: More fun with footnotes! (LONG)
>
>Hi Cindy,
>
>I think after previous discussions, the concensus was that the use of the
>word "footnotes" or "end footnotes" was considered too verbose and a lot of
>unnecessary work.
>As for the use of square brackets to enclose the notes sections at the
>bottom of pages, my personal opinion is that it is unnecessary as well as an
>inappropriate use of square brackets. I'm mostly thinking of square brackets
>used in nonfiction, where they usually mean that text has been added to or
>changed by the author to fit the context.
>
>My personal preference is still to use "* * *" after the body of the text
>and before the notes begin.
>After the notes is generally the end of the page and it seems fairly obvious
>where the end of the page is and a new one begins.
>
>Hope that makes sense...
>Deborah
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>[mailto:bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Cindy
>Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 7:15 PM
>To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: More fun with footnotes! (LONG)
>
>The last thing I remember seeing, and I think that's what she means by
>Deborah's plan of denoting footnotes in the text,is
> in text, put
>space asterisk the number and another space after the number,
>
>then write footnotes before the footnotes and end of
>footnotes in brackets after the footnotes.
>
>I assume it means bracket colon footnotes .....
>
>I've been doing the in-test thng but haven't gotten to the end-of-page
>footnotes in my book yet.
>Cindy
>
>----- Original Message -----
>> From: Martha Rafter <mlhr@xxxxxxx>
>> To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Cc:
>> Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 1:30 PM
>> Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: More fun with footnotes! (LONG)
>>
>> Oh My Gosh; now I'm really confused! What happened to Doug's idea of
>> [footnote or [footnotes at the beginning of the notes and a single right
>> bracket ] at the end of the notes? HELP!!
>> Marty
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Mayrie ReNae
>> Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 12:47 PM
>> To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: More fun with footnotes! (LONG)
>>
>> Hi Evan,
>>
>> In the new iteration of the scanning and proofreading manual, which I'm
>> still working on, we will be adopting Deborah's means of noting footnotes.
>>
>> Mayrie
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> [mailto:bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Evan Reese
>> Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 7:53 AM
>> To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: More fun with footnotes! (LONG)
>>
>> Well, I guess I'm gonna have to open this can of worms again, but I
>thought
>> the numbered ones were supposed to have parentheses around them. I see the
>> stars for the notes at the bottom of the page, but you've got a star in
>> front of the numbered notes which are not at the bottom of the page. I
>> thought those were supposed to be enclosed in parentheses.
>>
>> Evan
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Tracy Carcione" <carcione@xxxxxxxxxx>
>> To: <bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 10:27 AM
>> Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: More fun with footnotes! (LONG)
>>
>>
>>> Deborah, your solution seems best to me. I can't think of a braille
>>> character that would be better than a star.
>>> Tracy
>>>
>>>> Hi all,
>>>>
>>>> This message is going to be rather long and I apologize in advance.
>>>> I'm looking for input, particularly from braille readers, for a
>> footnote
>>>> formatting scenario that I'm currently puzzling over. It's not
>> the first
>>>> time I've encountered this as I think it's rather uncommon, but
>> it does
>>>> happen.
>>>>
>>>> I've been using a space followed by an asterisk(*) to set off
>> footnotes
>>>> within text and that seems to work well, whether the associated note
>>>> appears
>>>> at the end of the page, chapter or book.
>>>> Sometimes when the numbered notes appear at the end of the chapter or
>>>> book,
>>>> in addition to the numbered footnotes, an author inserts an asterisk
>> (*)
>>>> to
>>>> indicate a note at the bottom of the page.
>>>> To make this even more interesting, there are sometimes multiple
>>>> instances
>>>> of these notes. Instead of multiple asterisks, a character, usually
>>>> called
>>>> a
>>>> dagger, is used for the second one, and a double dagger for the third,
>>>> etc.
>>>> These characters usually scan as either a lower case "t" or
>> "f."
>>>> What I've done in the past is use a double asterisk (**) for the
>> dagger,
>>>> and
>>>> triple asterisk (***) for the double dagger.
>>>> Whew! If you've gotten this far, thank you.
>>>>
>>>> Now my current situation: I have a page with all of the above. I am
>>>> including the page below as I have it formatted. It seems a bit busy,
>> but
>>>> I
>>>> don't know what else to do.
>>>> So-- braille readers especially-- is there a character that can be
>>>> represented in braille to replace the dagger and double dagger? The
>>>> place
>>>> in this page that gets really clunky is at footnote number 8. There is
>> a
>>>> dagger for the second note at the bottom of the page, followed by
>>>> numbered
>>>> note 8.
>>>>
>>>> Page from the book:
>>>>
>>>> The Lowell Offering achieved international fame. Charles Dickens in his
>>>> American Notes referred to it as the "first clear notes of real
>> life in
>>>> America." An American returning from England reported: "The
>> Lowell
>>>> Offering
>>>> is probably exciting more attention in England, than any other American
>>>> publication. It is talked of in the political as well as literary
>> world."
>>>> And in France, Thiers * arose in the Chamber of Deputies, waved a copy
>> of
>>>> the Lowell Offering in the air, and solemnly proclaimed that the
>> magazine
>>>> proved that in a democracy, labor could possess a mind and soul as well
>>>> as
>>>> a
>>>> body. *7
>>>> It is hardly surprising that the Lowell Offering was welcomed by
>> factory
>>>> owners, and that they sent a written tribute to the editors, praising
>>>> "the
>>>> worthy enterprise in which they are engaged." ** *8 For the
>> editors of
>>>> the
>>>> Lowell Offering were not in the least concerned with wages and hours.
>> "We
>>>> could do nothing to regulate the price of wages of the world,"
>> wrote one
>>>> of
>>>> the editors. "We would not if we could, at least we would not make
>> that a
>>>> prominent subject in our pages, for we believe there are things of even
>>>> greater importance." As for hours and working conditions-these
>> were
>>>> matters
>>>> over which workers "have no control." They would come as a
>> result of the
>>>> kind-heartedness of the factory owners. The corporations would "in
>> their
>>>> own
>>>> good time introduce the ten-hour system, and will not this be a noble
>>>> deed?"
>>>> *9
>>>> What, then, were the "things of even greater importance"? The
>> only thing
>>>> that really mattered, said the magazine's editor, was to
>> "elevate,
>>>> instruct
>>>> and purify the mind and soul of the workers; to give them an outlet for
>>>> the
>>>> spiritual and emotional needs of the soul; to provide them with
>> sweetness
>>>> and light." Let the factory girls, therefore, meet in improvement
>> circles
>>>> where they would read and study. Armed with learning and culture, they
>>>> could
>>>> protect themselves from the crushing power of the machine which
>>>> dehumanized
>>>> the worker and robbed him of dignity and self-assurance. At the same
>>>> time,
>>>> they would prove to the world that there was "Mind among the
>> Spindles."
>>>> As
>>>> long as the mind and the soul were free, what did it matter what
>> happened
>>>> to
>>>> the body? The philosophy of the factory girls should be that of the
>>>> Apostles: "Having food and raiment, let us be therewith
>> content." *10
>>>> The Lowell Offering was popular everywhere but among the factory girls.
>>>> True, they wrote poems and stories for the magazine, believing
>>>>
>>>> * * *
>>>>
>>>> * In 1871, Thiers played a conspicuous role in the brutal suppression
>> of
>>>> the
>>>> Paris Commune and in the wholesale slaughter of the Paris proletariat
>>>> during
>>>> the "Bloody Week" when reaction triumphed.
>>>> ** in January, 1843, the Offering was purchased by William Schouler
>> from
>>>> its
>>>> former proprietors. Schouler was an agent of the mill owners, a bitter
>>>> foe
>>>> of the ten-hour day, and was intensely hated by almost all factory
>> girls.
>>>> In
>>>> a signed statement, Schouler called upon all "who feel an interest
>> in the
>>>> progress and good name of the factory system" to support the
>> Offering.
>>>> End of page.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks for any and all help!
>>>> Deborah
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
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