I don't know what the Braille translator does with them. As I recall, it
either doesn't display them properly, or it only puts in one dash instead of
two, which is what you should have in the Braille file. I do know that in
books I scan and read as rtf files, they are not properly displayed on my
Pac Mate. I generally convert them to double dashes with a quick search and
replace all in Word before sending them up to Bookshare.
I'm not changing that. I don't see why Braille readers should have to
suffer through crummy-looking text because someday some future software
upgrade just might fix the problem - assuming there is one.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Scott Blanks" <scottsjb@xxxxxxxxx>
To: <bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Saturday, June 03, 2006 11:31 AM
Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: M dash, how to make it?
I'm curious though, which comes out better in braille: m dash, or double dash? Does it matter? I seem to specifically remember several people on this list encouraging the conversion of m dashes to double dashes for the benefit of braille readers.
Can anybody comment?
Scott
----- Original Message ----- From: "Pratik patel" <pratikp1@xxxxxxxxx>
To: <bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Saturday, June 03, 2006 10:39 AM
Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: M dash, how to make it?
Cindy,
Please stick with the M-dash character when you enter it. The automated
tools may not support the proper conversion, but, we have to make sure that
future versions of those tools do support such conversions. The em-dash
character is a slightly shorter character than the double dash (--). I know
we have been working with the formatting to satisfy the stripper
requirement; but we should try to take a conservative approach when editting
the original text especially when it comes to formatting. In some cases, we
might have to move words around or make slight font changes but we should
avoid making other changes.
Pratik
Pratik Patel Director, CUNY Assistive technology Services (CATS) The City University of New York pratikp1@xxxxxxxxx
-----Original Message----- From: bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Cindy Sent: Saturday, June 03, 2006 12:55 AM To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: M dash, how to make it?
Is Lissi right in what she says about two dashes instead of an em dash being easier to read in braile? What about with Daisy? What should I be doing, em dash or double dash?
Cindy
--- Estelnalissi <airadil@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Dear Jake,
Your directions worked perfectly! I'm levitating! We all know I'm not the fastest barge on the canal when it comes to computers, but your instructions put those m dashes exactly where I needed them.
The M dash will be especially easy to remember because it's insert 4 as you said for jaws, and then tapping e 4 times to reach m dash and enter not even having to go to OK!
Also exciting is the fact I saw a slew of items listed in the insert 4 dialogue box which may turn out to be useful!!
The book I'm working on is an Irish memoir. Instead of using quotes or apostrophes, there's a dash or m dash before all quotes and no mark to show the end of the quote. It's plain in print because quotes are inserted farther than the narrative, but I think braille readers will quickly catch the pattern.
While blissfully making my corrections with the new command, I noticed that the scanner read these unique indications of quotes as dash about half of the time and M dash the other half with some minus signs thrown in for variety. The mixture was random so I made a command decision to use the simpler dash to indicate quotes. I'm on page 27 now and all quotes are uniformly indicated with a single dash, easier for me and the reader.
By the way, when this book is approved, I'm going to mention that while anyone interested in quirky humor, Irish culture and recalling life from 1959 through 1960 something will like this book, but the POV, and the father, a kind of hero to the author will really appeal to the gritty guys among the members. I'm entranced, but regularly amused in spite of myself and grossed out, too.
Always with love,
Lissi
Thanks for helping me to enjoy another break through!
----- Original Message ----- From: "Jake Brownell" <jabrown@xxxxxxxxx>
To: <bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Friday, June 02, 2006 6:52 PM
Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: M dash, how to make
it?
> Hi Lissi,
> There are two easy ways to insert an em-dash
>
> If you're using Microsoft Word, you can press
CTRL+ALT+the minus sign on
> the numpad.
>
> If you're using JAWS, you can press INSERT+4 (the
4 on the regular
> keyboard) and you'll get a list of symbols. Press
the letter e a few times
> and you'll find em dash, then press enter.
>
> That's all there is to it.
>
> Jake
> ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Estelnalissi" <airadil@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> To: <bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Friday, June 02, 2006 5:16 PM
> Subject: [bksvol-discuss] M dash, how to make it?
>
>
>> Dear Volunteer Friends,
>>
>> There was a discussion here about making that
long dash called m dash by
>> Jaws using microsoft word while validating an RTF
file. How to make it
>> with other programs might have been mentioned,
too.
>>
>> What I mostly remember is that it was suggested
that just using 2 dashes
>> comes out better for the braille reader in
Bookshare's BRF file of a
>> book. So, I decided that when I had a choice, I'd
use 2 dashes.
>>
>> However, the book I'm validating is already
packed with m dashes, so if I
>> fix one, I thought it should match them.
>>
>> How do I make an m dash? Occasionally jaws calls
an m dash a minus, and I
>> want to replace the minus signs with m dashes. If
anyone can point me to
>> the answer or remind me how to do this, I'd
appreciate it and save the
>> information in my Bookshare Tips file.
>>
>> While I wait to hear about this, I'll mark the
spot and go on. I'm only
>> on page 12, but this book really motivates me to
make good progress.
>>
>> Hope all of your current endeavors are going
swimmingly. - Smile
>>
>> Always with love,
>>
>> Lissi
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>>
>>
>>
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Release Date: 6/1/2006
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