[bksvol-discuss] Re: Knitting books--majority of members not blind
- From: Valerie Maples <vlmaples@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Sat, 11 Feb 2012 23:14:56 -0800 (PST)
I think you explained it pretty well, Roger. I do agree that it appears there
are more blind volunteers than dyslexics on the list as most dyslexics would
not
make good proofreaders, although probably decent scanners. As to the name
change to Learning Ally, the PC explanation was it was a more broad umbrella
and
supposedly less discriminatory and person centered, but frankly, I have never
been PC and it sounds more childish to me.
The thing we love about Bookshare is it is the first source of accessible TEXT,
preserving literacy opportunities for kids wanting to actually read the books
in
print or Braille. For that I am forever grateful!
Valerie
Keep up with Nichole's recovery:
http://www.caringbridge.org/visit/nicholemaples
>
>From: Roger Loran Bailey <rogerbailey81@xxxxxxx>
>To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>Sent: Sat, February 11, 2012 8:14:25 PM
>Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: Knitting books--majority of members not blind
>
>Blindness is considered to be a low incidence disability. I am sure, of
>course, that the proportion of blind people who use Bookshare is
>considerably higher than it is in the general population, but there are
>still a lot more dyslexics in this world than there are blind people. As
>far
>as I can tell, though, the blind people on the volunteer list outnumber
>the
>dyslexics. It does not surprise me, though, that the number of users who
>are
>dyslexic outnumber the blind users. There is another organization that
>caters to print impaired people that used to be named Recording for the
>Blind. At a certain point in time they changed their name to Recording for
>the Blind and Dyslexic saying that the new name more closely reflected
>the population that they served. They actually served more dyslexics than
>blind people. Then even more recently they changed their name again and
>this
>time it was to Learning Ally. One of the ostensible reasons was that they
>did serve people with disabilities other than dyslexia and blindness, but
>there was also some indication that the dyslexic clients did not want to
>be
>so closely associated with blind people. I suppose you can guess that made
>quite a few blind people a bit miffed.
>
>On 2/11/2012 8:31 PM, Cindy wrote:
>Really. Interesting. I did know that some members are dyslexic
>and
>perhaps for physical impairments cannot hold books to read but I
>had
>assumed hat the majority of bookshare members are legally blind.
>Mayrie, or Carrie, an you tell us /me how the majority of members
>qualify?
>>Cindy
>>
>>
>>
>>From: Mayrie ReNae <mayrierenae@xxxxxxxxx>
>>>To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>Sent: Saturday, February 11, 2012 9:56 AM
>>>Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: Knitting books
>>>
>>>Hi Sandi,
>>>
>>>I know that Bookshare hasn't given up on finding a way to
>>>make
>>>the graphics
>>>accessible. I'm going to look into whether the images can
>>>be
>>>legally
>>>described via the Diagram program that Bookshare has in
place.
>>>
>>>I know that people are not going to be happy with this bit
>>>of my
>>>opinion,
>>>and some factoids, so get your rotten veggies ready to throw
>>>at
>>>me. The
>>>parts of the books that are graphics are not accessible to
>>>blind
>>>members.
>>>And work is being done to figure out how to change that.
>>>However, they are
>>>accessible to others with print disabilities, so they are
>>>not
>>>completely
>>>inaccessible. The majority of Bookshare members are not
>>>blind.
>>>So, it
>>>doesn't make sense to deprive books to all that are
>>>inaccessible
>>>to some.
>>>
>>>
>>>Please don't lose hope that Bookshare will figure out a way
>>>to
>>>make these
>>>things accessible in some way. Bookshare knows about the
>>>problem.
>>>Bookshare wants to make as much accessible as possible. And
>>>we
>>>haven't
>>>exhausted all possibilities for this to happen.
>>>
>>>Don't give up hope yet!
>>>
>>>Mayrie
>>>
>>>
>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>From: bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>[mailto:bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
>>>Sandi
>>>Ryan
>>>Sent: Saturday, February 11, 2012 8:23 AM
>>>To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: Knitting books
>>>
>>>Hi Mary,
>>>
>>>So can anything be done to make these charts accessible? If
>>>not, there is
>>>little point adding them to the Bookshare collection, which
>>>indicates they
>>>are accessible when they are not.
>>>
>>>Sandi
>>>
>>>----- Original Message -----
>>>From: "Mayrie ReNae" <mayrierenae@xxxxxxxxx>
>>>To: <bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>Sent: Saturday, February 11, 2012 12:46 AM
>>>Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: Knitting books
>>>
>>>
>>>> Hi Sandi,
>>>>
>>>> No, the images won't be accessible. If they were, they'd
>>>> have
>>>>been
>>>>
>>>> rendered
>>>> readably in the daisy file in the first place. Sorry!
>>>>
>>>> Mayrie
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> [mailto:bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
>>>> Sandi
>>>>Ryan
>>>> Sent: Friday, February 10, 2012 8:45 PM
>>>> To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: Knitting books
>>>>
>>>> Hi Mary,
>>>>
>>>> I can try to get them as Daisy books with images, but will
>>>>those images be
>>>> readable? The symbols are often x's or *'s, but sometimes
>>>> are
>>>>cute little
>>>> icons used to represent a particular stitch. Ah, the very
>>>> good
>>>>old days
>>>> when patterns were written out, not represented in charts!
>>>>
>>>> Sandi
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: "Mayrie ReNae" <mayrierenae@xxxxxxxxx>
>>>> To: <bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> Sent: Friday, February 10, 2012 9:24 PM
>>>> Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: Knitting books
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Hi Sandi,
>>>>>
>>>>> What I think happens is that the charts are available in
>>>>> the
>>>>>"daisy with
>>>>> images" books, but not present in the "daisy" or brf
>>>>> books
>>>>>because they
>>>>> are
>>>>> graphics of somesort, just not straight text, which
>>>>> Bookshare's
>>>>>
>>>>> conversion
>>>>> tools don't know how to handle. I'd bet the images that
>>>>> you
>>>>>want are
>>>>> present in the "daisy with images" files of books, but
>>>>> aren't
>>>>>accessible
>>>>> because the images aren't straight text.
>>>>>
>>>>> Just a guess on my part, as I can't verify that myself.
>>>>>
>>>>> Mayrie
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>> [mailto:bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
>>>>> Sandi
>>>>>Ryan
>>>>> Sent: Friday, February 10, 2012 7:17 PM
>>>>> To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>> Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: Knitting books
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi Debby,
>>>>>
>>>>> Often the charts are mentioned in the patterns themselves
>>>>> (use
>>>>>Chart X to
>>>>> complete pattern rows 9-57, reading the K rows from left
>>>>> to
>>>>>right and the
>>>>> P
>>>>> rows from right to left), something like that--and then
>>>>> no
>>>>>chart is
>>>>>
>>>>> there.
>>>>> It may be that Bookshare's software chucks the charts
>>>>> because
>>>>>they look
>>>>> like
>>>>> garbage characters, but I don't know that. I just know
>>>>> it's
>>>>>frustrating
>>>>> to
>>>>> read through a pattern, say to myself "Oh, that looks
>>>>> great!
>>>>>Can't wait
>>>>> to
>>>>> make it," and then find out I can't because the charts
>>>>> are
>>>>>missing.
>>>>>
>>>>> Sandi
>>>>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>> From: "Debby Franson" <the.bee@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>> To: <bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>> Sent: Friday, February 10, 2012 8:58 PM
>>>>> Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: Knitting books
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Tracy, Jamie and anyone who has had anything to do
>>>>>> with
>>>>>>knitting
>>>>>> books!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Are the charts missing entirely, or are they a graphic,
>>>>>> which
>>>>>>would do
>>>>>> those like me with no sight, no good?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Debby
>>>>>>
>>>>>> At 08:47 AM 2/10/2012, Tracy Carcione wrote
>>>>>>>I guess we've identified an area where our books are
>>>>>>>better than
>>>>>>>PQ--we
>>>>>>>take the trouble to put in complicated charts if we can.
>>>>>>>Tracy
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> > Hi Tracy,
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > I've noticed some tables and charts missing in PQ
>>>>>>> > books too.
>>>>>>>One I
>>>>>>> > downloaded was supposed to have a family tree. It
>>>>>>> > explained
>>>>>>>how to
>>>>>>> > read
>>>>>>> > the
>>>>>>> > tree, but the tree itself wasn't there.
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > Sue S.
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>> > From: Tracy Carcione
>>>>>>> > Sent: Friday, February 10, 2012 7:36 AM
>>>>>>> > To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>> > Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: Knitting books
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > Hi Jamie.
>>>>>>> > Many blessings on your head for taking all that
>>>>>>> > trouble! I
>>>>>>>know how
>>>>>>> > hard
>>>>>>> > it is to translate those charts; I've occasionally
>>>>>>> > tortured
>>>>>>>my sister
>>>>>>> > with
>>>>>>> > it.
>>>>>>> > Guess I'll have to look for knitting books submitted
>>>>>>> > by
>>>>>you.
>>>>>>> > The PQ knitting books are full of charts. Or should
>>>>>>> > I say
>>>>>>>lacking,
>>>>>>> > since
>>>>>>> > the charts aren't actually there at all.
>>>>>>> > Tracy
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> >> Tracy, the books I have done with knitting charts, I
>>>have
>>>>>>> >> painstakingly
>>>>>>> >> typed in the graphs with whatever symbol is in the
>>>>>>> >> book (x,
>>>>>>>o, /
>>>>>>> >> whatever).
>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>> >> They are extremely difficult books to do even when
>>>>>>> >> there are
>>>>>>>only a
>>>>>>> >> few
>>>>>>> >> graphs.
>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>> >> --
>>>>>>> >> Jamie in Michigan
>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>> >> Currently Reading: Heads You Lose by Lisa Lutz
>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>> >> See everything I've read this year at:
>>>>>>> >> www.michiganrxtech.com/books.html
>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > To unsubscribe from this list send a blank Email to
>>>>>>> > bksvol-discuss-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
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>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > -----
>>>>>>> > No virus found in this message.
>>>>>>> > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>>>>>>> > Version: 2012.0.1913 / Virus Database: 2112/4800 -
>>>>>>> > Release
>>>>>>>Date:
>>>>>>> > 02/09/12
>>>>>>> >
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>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this list send a blank Email to
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>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> mailto:<the.bee@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> The tongue of the wise uses knowledge rightly, But the
>>>>>> mouth of
>>>>>>fools
>>>>>> pours forth foolishness.
>>>>>> Proverbs 15:2 NKJV
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "Teach me, and I will hold my tongue
>>>>>> ; Cause me to understand wherein I have erred.
>>>>>> Job 6:24 NKJV
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
>>>>>
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>>>>
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>>>
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