[bksvol-discuss] Re: For Gwen and Robert

  • From: "gwen tweedy" <gstweedy@xxxxxxx>
  • To: <bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Tue, 1 Dec 2009 08:16:26 -0600

Thank you so much

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Shelley L. Rhodes 
  To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
  Sent: Tuesday, December 01, 2009 8:09 AM
  Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: For Gwen and Robert

  Monica, is right.

  I have been volunteering for many years, and am functionally blind, I can't 
read print, I use a screen reader to do all of my work on the computer and my 
monitor stays off.

  Like Monica, if I find a book that requires the pictures or charts I find 
someone who can see to do them.  Smile.

  Gwen I don't have any right now, but when I get a simple book, will gladly 
hold it for you.

  I did that with Doug, gave him five easy books to work on and gave him that 
first couple of successes.  Smile.

  I know my scans were bad, and luckily they aren't on the site any longer, 

  It is a learning process.

  Shelley L. Rhodes, VRT

  Guide dogs for the Blind Alumni Association

  Reading a book is like rewriting it for yourself. You bring to a novel, 
anything you read, all your experience of the world. You bring your history and 
you read it in your own terms. -Angela Carter, novelist and journalist 

    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: Monica Willyard 
    To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
    Sent: Tuesday, December 01, 2009 12:19 AM
    Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: For Gwen and Robert

    Hi Gwen. The things you've mentioned are cosmetic and are not mandatory 
according to the manual. They're like the rosettes of icing on a cake. The 
layers of the cake are what really matter in the end. As a proofreader, your 
primary job is to listen to all of the text, fix scannos to the best of your 
ability, make sure all of the book is there, and make sure that the copyright 
notice is intact. If you do those things, Bookshare will accept your book. You 
don't have to be a computer genius, and we have several submitters who work 
well with new proofreaders.

    Just like anything else you learn, please start small. Consider 
proofreading a book by a submitter who has done a lot of the prep work. Try 
working with someone who won't mind if you make a mistake. Focus on reading the 
book and getting comfortable with the process of proofreading. Then you can 
decide how far you want to go with adjusting the cosmetics. 

    You might want to start out with books that are rated excellent from the 
step 1 page. Books rated good are harder to proof. They would be sort of like 
jumping in a pool at the deep end while not knowing how to swim.

    You don't have to worry about line length. That's something people using 
Word deal with. I keep thinking that you and Robert use Kurzweil for scanning. 
If so, use that for proofreading too. It has many features that make 
proofreading easier. If you use your Kurzweil for proofreading, you won't have 
to adjust your page size or margins like Word users do. 

    Kurzweil tells you when it finds a page break, so you'll be able to tell 
that they're present. It even makes a sound when it goes to the next page.

    As far as extra blank lines go, the Bookshare software removes those while 
converting to daisy format. The primary reason some people remove them by hand 
is because it looks better for sighted proofreaders. Since you'd be the 
proofreader, it wouldn't be necessary for you to do that. Bookshare's tool will 
do it automatically when Carrie approves your book. Over time, you may start to 
notice line breaks in the middle of sentences. You can fix those. That skill 
can wait a bit though while you're learning about working with text.

    If you proofread in Kurzweil, you can handle fonts with a hotkey built into 
that program. While this is helpful for good navigation, the Bookshare software 
knows what to do if you aren't able to adjust the fonts. I can teach you how to 
do this. It sounds harder than it really is. You won't need any sighted help to 
do it, and you can't break anything by using the font hotkey.

    Gwen, you already have what it takes to be a good proofreader. You just 
haven't honed the skill yet. You are smart enough to do it, and making mistakes 
just means you're learning. (smile)

    Monica Willyard
    "The best way to predict the future is to create it." -- Peter Drucker

    From: bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
[mailto:bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of gwen tweedy
    Sent: Monday, November 30, 2009 11:23 PM
    To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
    Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: For Gwen and Robert

    I think what you do is grand.
    I think what  scares me about proof reading is this.
    I've heard you have to change faunts, and make sure lines are so long and 
cut off at the right places.
    It seems like I've heard that anyway, and I'd have no idea about that, I 
just know what things sound like to me.
    All I have are my ears or seeing if something occurrs and is  right in a 
    I wouldn't have the least idea, if my line is to long, all I know is what 
it sounds like in my ears.
    I can't look at it to see like how long the line is or the paragraph is 
stuff like that.
    I can tell split words and can fix those and put Chapters in I hope at the 
right places, and I think I could take the headings out.
    But other than that, all this other stuff y'all do in proof reading I'd be 
just lost.

      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: Kim Friedman 
      To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
      Sent: Monday, November 30, 2009 9:37 PM
      Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: For Gwen and Robert

      My goodness Gwen, you have nothing to fear when it comes to proofreading 
should you decide to do it. One thing I can tell you is that there are many 
ways to do it. I have a BrailleNote mPower and I use it as a Braille display 
while I read a book from the beginning to the end. I listen to my screen reader 
read the text while I follow along with my fingers using the BrailleNote. I'd 
call it kind of like a feedback or redundancy thing. Have you seen those flour 
sifters with double or triple screens in them? Think of what I do as if I were 
sifting flour because what the ears hear the fingers check. I have to make sure 
that everything is all present and accounted for, title, author bylines, 
copyright dates, ISbn numbers,
      publishers, etc. After the prefatory material I read every word of the 
book. Now I'm taking in the story (if I'm reading fiction), I'm checking to see 
if there are any errors in the scan you might have missed. If I find any, I use 
the delete key so I only get rid of stuff that is extraneous to the text. I'd 
write you and let you know what I'm doing. If I come across a bit of something 
in the text I'm not sure about, I'd email you and ask you about it, pasting the 
bit of text I'm having trouble with in the email to you. You'd send me the copy 
of what the text should be, and I make sure it's in the file I'm working with. 
One thing I heard right from the start was to have a copy of the file that 
isn't touched in case I mess up the one I'm working with. I'm still in the 
beginning stages of this thing. I don't do anything fancy. Eventually I expect 
to learn the art of this. What I want to know is if the text makes sense. I 
don't heed the word processing program should it have grammar suggestions for 
me. If I come across a weird spelling of a word or name, I'd want to know how 
many times it's in the text. I'd probably write you to verify that the word and 
the way it's spelled is supposed to be in the text. My philosophy is to do just 
enough and err on the side of caution. Some people may not use Braille at all 
when proofreading while others do. I'm still learning the ropes, but so far 
what I've done is in the Bookshare collection so I must be doing something 
right or at least I hope this is so. Nobody will twist your arm and you can 
proofread anything that interests you. So far everything has interested me. The 
very first thing I did was a children's book, but the others I've done are 
fiction books for grownups. Regards, Kim.  

      From: bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
[mailto:bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of gwen tweedy
      Sent: Monday, November 30, 2009 2:56 PM
      To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
      Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: For Gwen and Robert

      I too assumed that those books would go very fast simply from  things I 
have read here from time to time.
      I think they are getting lost in the admin cue now that would be up to 
him to correct me if I am wrong.
      And yes for me, if I were a proof reader, except for some of the books 
he's helped me with, I wouldn't read them either I just can't read those kinds 
of books. 
      As for my books, I've learned a lot, I feel that even as much as recently 
I have gotten better, but as for myself, I am keenly aware that my books might 
be as fast on the uptake because of my past reputation as a new scanner.
      So I understand that, and can now deal with that.
      If I find that I am not making it I promise you, I'll be the first to 
leave volunteering altogether, because I  do not need nor want to be in the way 
of good reading material here bookshare is so famous for.
      I promise you, I would not want anyone putting up junk from me that would 
not be fair to y'all.
      Some things you can learn, some things a person can't and if I fail to 
get it, then I'm out of here lock stock and barrel.
      Most here scan and proof excellently, and I would no more  tarnish that  
reputation for this whole world.
      It was my hope when I first  put my name up to be a  volunteer to put up 
more of the Christian type of books, if not Christian wholesome books  those my 
 grandma would care to read.
      But that wholly has not happened,  from a number of factors of my own 
making the buck stops here as it were.
      If I fail to meet this my personal goal, that at that time, which could 
be today, tomorrow, or perhaps never then I would bow out and leave it to those 
who know best.
      I wish I could proof books, but I've bungled scans lord knows what I'd do 
to a proof.
      Plus there are so many rules to proofing my lands I couldn't keep up with 
them all, that is to hard for me simple  mind LOL.
      I most likely should have just stuck to reading it would have been a lot 
less trouble for us all.
      You have a wonderful day,

        ----- Original Message ----- 
        From: Monica Willyard 
        To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
        Sent: Monday, November 30, 2009 3:26 PM
        Subject: [bksvol-discuss] For Gwen and Robert

        Gwen, you're right. Robert is an experienced and valuable member of our 
community. Robert, how many books do you have that are waiting to be approved? 
Are they on step 1 or in the admin queue? 

        Gwen, there are several factors in play regarding Robert's books. I 
don't know if you're aware of all of these, so I thought I'd share them. Some 
of them can probably be addressed by people on this list. Others can't.

        On the staff side, Carrie was on vacation for a week before 
Thanksgiving. Also, most of the staff had some time off last week for the 
holiday. I have found that she generally approves books from volunteers within 
24 to 48 hours of their entry into the admin queue. Carrie used to be a 
volunteer just like us, and she remembers the frustration of waiting and 
waiting for a book to be approved. She has worked with Robert as a fellow 
volunteer as well and knows of his skills and flexible attitude.

        From here, it looks like the bottleneck right now is in getting books 
proofread. The number of books on step 1 is piling up again. Our number of 
active volunteers and their preferences for reading determine how fast a book 
is processed. This factor affects everyone who submits books. For awhile 
everyone was worried about not having any books to work on. Some people quit 
looking for new books on step 1 because of all of the books with holds on them. 
Now there are a lot of excellent books needing a proofreader.

        The other factor, on a more personal level, is hard for me to explain. 
Robert is a consistent and dedicated volunteer. I respect him for his 
dedication and teamwork. Yet I am hesitant to take his books for a personal 
reason. In the past, Robert has been willing to scan some adult-rated content 
for Bookshare. It's my perception that much of what he scans would be 
classified as steamy romances. I prefer not to read the steamier books. This 
isn't about Robert or his skills as a submitter. It's about me and what I want 
to read. I generally don't like to draw attention to this issue since I think 
it's a personal one on my part. Since I feel uncomfortable asking Robert which 
books are adult, I let others take his books when he submits. I figured it 
would make him angry if I asked about it. If I am wrong about what Robert 
submits, I apologize and take full responsibility for not checking out my 
assumptions with him.

        I think what I'm saying is that we might do a better job of 
communicating with each other. I know I need to do that. I didn't know that 
Robert's books weren't getting added to the collection. I also assumed that 
most people are more comfortable with adult content than I am and that those 
would be done quickly. I could be wrong on both counts.

        The last thing I want is for you or Robert to feel ignored or 
unappreciated. I don't have an immediate solution. I think we could find ways 
to work this out together, with the help of the Bookshare community. It would 
help us fix the problem if we know exactly what's going on, if the books are on 
step 1, or are they getting lost in the admin queue.

        Monica Willyard
        "The best way to predict the future is to create it." -- Peter Drucker


        At 10:32 AM 11/30/2009, you wrote:

          I think a timely manner is the key.
          And those who have scanned for years and their books are good, and 
everyone knows they are good, to me there shouldn't be a delay.
          Some books get up there right away, so what is the difference  in 
           Especially those of like  Robert's when his books have been tried 
and true for a long time.
           Eventually  volunteers  are gonna quit submitting books, because 
they aren't getting anywhere. Some books stay up there for a long time.
          It's grand for   kids books grand for grants, but I think they are 
forgetting the  submitters  especially those hard working ones like Bob who 
turns in a quality scan each and every time not like his wife who turns no 
quality scans LOL.
          I understand me, but Bob that is different.
          His should go right away.

            ----- Original Message ----- 

            From: robert tweedy 

            To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 

            Sent: Monday, November 30, 2009 11:58 AM

            Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: What is the main concern these days?

            That's fine as long as our books get into the system on a timey 

              ----- Original Message ----- 

              From: Denise Thompson 

              To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 

              Sent: Tuesday, December 01, 2009 2:50 PM

              Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: What is the main concern these days?

              I think BKS's concern is to do books that fit their grant money. 
educational which seems to be most books for kids and teens in addition to text 
books, of course. Adult books don't seem to be educational- especially those 
that have some romance in them. Since they have out-sourcers and do their grant 
books with them as well as in house, I feel like I need to continue to scan 
adult books for the rest of us who aren't students and who don't want to read 
kids books and teen books. 


              At 09:32 AM 11/30/2009, you wrote:

                I've noticed a strong emphasis on children's books as well. 
This is wonderful, so long as it isn't at the expense of books for us adults, 


                robert tweedy wrote:

                  I am just wondering about bookshare policy of submitted 
books. Taking a look at the cue, it looks like children's books which is okay 
but what about books that are just for pleasure.
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