[bksvol-discuss] Re: Discussion boards and Freelists guidelines
- From: Guido Corona <guidoc@xxxxxxxxxx>
- To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Thu, 30 Dec 2004 14:04:59 -0600
Marissa, I do like internet-based discussion boards in principle, but I
agree with the other volunteers that in most cases discussion board
implementation are anything but blind friendly, except for the one I and
another Bookshare community member, participate to on a regular bases at:
http://www.audiogon.com.
I find consulting, participating, reading, responding, posting new topics
a snap. The discussion forums are essentially all text based and all
messages are accessible in chronological sequence on any given thread. By
default only the date and a one line fragment is shown on each msg.
Clicking on the fragment expands to the entire msg. Clicking on the date
expands all msg following that one to the end of the thread. Responding
to a thread or initiating one automatically adds the thread to an
easy-to-use 'my threads' page. Each threads also has an email link to the
writer, just in case private exchanges need to be initiated. Searching
for a user on the system will also yield a list of all threads initiated
or responded to by the users. Clicking on any such thread will display
the thread with all posting by the target user expanded, and all other
postings collapsed. Threads are displayed in chuncks of 50 messages max
at a time.
I find this particular implementation has most of the advantages of both
the interactive eamil list and digests without most of the disadvantages:
1. No email inbox clutter.
2. The thread looks just like a digest but is always completely
interactive.
3. It is very easy to implement a keyword search capability to search for
postings and threads related to a particular issue: In a sense the
threads themselves become de facto FAQs and databases of useful
information.
4. It would be much easier for you to edit Aloysius and his friends out
when he/they get too enthusiastic--even old posted messages.
5. The admin can literally shut down and even delete an entire thread if
things get unbecoming of old gents like us.
Now for the single negative point I have experienced:
1. The multiline editing area is a basic very low level text area. There
is in such a control no provision for spellchecking, formatting, etc. . .
Unless the message is short, the author needs to take care to press the
enter key each once on a while to create a new line, otherwise poor JFW
may make things a little tedious when reviewing the entire msg and editing
it on a single line.
Very long postings are at times best created with an external editor like
HJ-PAD then copy/pasted into the text area.
There are RTF controls available for IE to offer a better editing
environment, but I know for a fact that my own IBM Home page Reader won't
handle them, and I suspect JFW may not find those accessible either.
Future support for IE RTF editing fields is something that we can of
course raise with appropriate urgency with the respective development
communities if needed.
In final analysis, discussion boards implementations are worth looking
into.
Guido
Guido Dante Corona
IBM Accessibility Center, Austin Tx.
Research Division,
Phone: 512. 838. 9735.
Email: guidoc@xxxxxxxxxxx
Web: http://www.ibm.com/able
"Marissa Mika" <Marissa.M@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent by: bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
12/30/2004 01:02 PM
Please respond to
bksvol-discuss
To
<bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
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Subject
[bksvol-discuss] Discussion boards and Freelists guidelines
Wooboy. I guess discussion boards don't have the same allure to our
users as they do to me. That's fine. If you want to stick with the
bksvol-discuss list and maintain this email format, by all means. You're
the customers and the volunteers here.
As for a list of guidelines about using this list, it should be really
simple.
1. The vast majority of you are adults. Please act like adults and treat
others with due courtesy and respect, even when dealing with tense and
inflammatory subject matter.
2. If you have a specific complaint or critique about Bookshare.org, I'd
appreciate it if you would forward your concern to a Bookshare.org staff
member first so we can try to work on the problem constructively.
3. If you change the subject of your email, change the subject line as
well as a courtesy to others.
4. Keep personal exchanges just that, personal. If you're writing to a
specific person and it's no longer relevant to the rest of the list,
take it off-list.
Am I missing anything here? Just use your common sense.
Happy new year everyone,
I'm wishing you all the best.
Marissa
-----Original Message-----
From: bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Christy
Schulte
Sent: Thursday, December 30, 2004 10:31 AM
To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: From List-serve to Discussion Board?
I tend to agree. I hate the message boards and tend to only visit them
when
absolutely necessary. They're probably really nice and quick for sighted
people, but with speech while they're doable, they're a pain. Not sure
how
many of us are speech users vs those who are sighted volunteers, though.
-----Original Message-----
From: bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]On Behalf Of Shelley L.
Rhodes
Sent: Thursday, December 30, 2004 1:27 PM
To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: From List-serve to Discussion Board?
With a dial up account, downloading your messages into say a program
like
Outlook Express or Outlook or what have you is much quicker than trying
to
navigate a message board. I am a member of one, and it is a lot of time
to
find the material I want, try to post a response, and keep track of
messages
here and there.
Email is much easier. And as they have said already it is much easier
to
delete a message, filter a submitter than it is to try to go from
message to
message on a message board.
They are nice to look at visually but a Pain to navigate, even nice
clean
ones.
Shelley L. Rhodes and Judson, guiding golden
juddysbuddy@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Guide Dogs For the Blind Inc.
Graduate Advisory Council
www.guidedogs.com
The vision must be followed by the venture. It is not enough to
stare up the steps - we must step up the stairs.
-- Vance Havner
----- Original Message -----
From: "Marissa Mika" <Marissa.M@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Thursday, December 30, 2004 11:48 AM
Subject: [bksvol-discuss] From List-serve to Discussion Board?
Hi Folks,
I suppose one option in all of this is that we move this discussion list
to a more controlled setting: a discussion board where (the
administrative) deleting of posts is an option. Such deletions would be
minimal, as I like the organic and informal nature of these discussions.
In extreme cases, however, I am not opposed to enforcing civility if it
maintains a better tone and representation of Bookshare.org.
A discussion board has many benefits. It's easier to follow the
individual discussion threads if you're not interested in cats but have
a passion for Epsons, for example. It would also decrease the number of
messages in your inbox that you would have to wade through on a daily
basis. Also, if volunteers are visiting a specific url, it would be
possible to provide links to a variety of pages, including scanning tips
and Rui's links to the lists.
I'm inclined to see how easy it would be to implement a discussion board
as opposed to this list-serve. Is there any feedback on this matter that
I should take into account?
Thanks,
Marissa
-----Original Message-----
From: bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Louise
Sent: Wednesday, December 29, 2004 4:10 PM
To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: txt page breaks redux
Now children, enough of this sparring. Does any of this have anything
to do
with Bookshare? Do we want Marissa to start cracking down on these type
of
discussions?
----- Original Message -----
From: Kenneth A. Cross
To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Wednesday, December 29, 2004 2:36 PM
Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: txt page breaks redux
Just another example of your concern for the customer.
----- Original Message -----
From: Guido Corona
To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Wednesday, December 29, 2004 3:16 PM
Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: txt page breaks redux
Thank you Dr. Cross, yours has been a Thorough treatment of the
matter
at hand" or is it a "compact biography?" of me. Thank goodness it is
not a
"Love Inspired Romance".
Guido Dante Corona
IBM Accessibility Center, Austin Tx.
Research Division,
Phone: 512. 838. 9735.
Email: guidoc@xxxxxxxxxxx
Web: http://www.ibm.com/able
"Kenneth A. Cross" <crossk@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent by: bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
12/29/2004 01:49 PM Please respond to
bksvol-discuss
To <bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
cc
Subject [bksvol-discuss] Re: txt page breaks redux
I want to support Mary's comments. Not only is Guido vigorously
trying
to
impose his standards, but he has made this a very unpleasant list
with
which to be associated. He routinely downs other volunteers,
forgetting
that we, too, are customers as well as volunteers, but he also
wastes
list
bime with humor which is very often off point. That might even be
okay,
but
express a view with which he disagrees, and suddenly your entire
personality
is suspect. You are discussing things which have already been
resolved,
even
though he might be the only one who thinks so.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mary Otten" <maryotten@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Wednesday, December 29, 2004 1:33 PM
Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: txt page breaks redux
> Guido,
> Here's a thought. Since there are lots of books on the download
page
which
are not in the txt format, and since there are people willing to
work on
those which you find unredeemable and others who would be
> interested in reading cleaned up versions of same, why don't you
concentrate on the better quality or at least the non txt items
rather
than
imposing your standards on the whole of BookShare, especially in the
> absence of word from the powers that be regarding this issue?
> In a note to Kelly, you wondered rhetorically what part of the
words
pride
of work people don't understand. In turn, I wonder what gives you
the
right
to grant yourself the authority to set standards which BookShare
> itself simply has not set. This whole problem can be avoided if
you
just
set the selection of books on step one to be viewed to something
other
than
all formats, e.g. kes or rtf.
> There is room for interpretation with respect to the "readability"
standard. But until BookShare comes out with a guideline regarding
this
whole page break business that will supercede what Marissa said
before
the
> Christmas break, I'd say your position on the page break issue is
more
like disregard of present policy rather than pride of work.
> I sure hope the staff at BookShare reaches consensus soon on this
issue
and then, let us all live with that decision, whatever it may be.
> Mary
>
>
>
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